Allegiance Online Stuttering

Terran · Post by **Terran** » Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:02 pm

sure... but what makes you think those issues are related? without actually being a coding expert?

Wasp · Post by **Wasp** » Tue Oct 04, 2016 6:21 pm

Terran wrote:QUOTE (Terran @ Oct 4 2016, 01:02 PM) sure... but what makes you think those issues are related? without actually being a coding expert?

When R5 was released, these symptoms showed up. The stuttering was first reported by Chaos, the controller issues were voiced by myself and others and even you (though you didn't say anything until R6... They (the controller lag and behavior issues) were found in the Alpha build of R5 and I've even tracked those problems down to the Dx9 client itself. I can't say for certain that the stutter is caused by the Dx9 coding until I can get a R4 server (off site) up and running.

After doing a butt load of online searches, I discovered that these are the tell signs that the "engine" has frame / timing issues. Many coders are struggling with this problem and it appears to be a common challenge in the game development world.

I think they are related because they all showed up as soon as the Dx9 alpha / retail versions were made public. Many of us remained on the non alpha version because the Dx9 was unplayable, then they pulled the Dx7 version and stuck everyone with the Dx9 client. I must add a disclaimer that says; I could be totally wrong with what specifically is causing these problems (and that pisses KGJV off)...I'm not certain that a "frame timing bug" is the cause, that is just my speculation however, the symptoms and the release of the 'all new' Dx9 project were simultaneous.

You're absolutely right, I'm no coder by a long shot. But my findings are correct and verifiable.

Wasp · Post by **Wasp** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:00 pm

Is this enough evidence for ya? How many right angles do you see? Tell us how this is possible if it ISN'T a coding problem! Ships would have to come to a complete stop, point in a new direction and THEN accelerate to be able to do these maneuvers... Don't tell me this isn't your Dx9 screw up...

Post by **MagisterXF94** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:11 pm

Constant bashing is not gonna help.

I appreciate your constant drive, tests and findings for having this fixed.

But telling people constantly "YOU $#@!ED UP!" isn't really helping.

KGJV will analyze the evidence, and will choose the best course of action.

Wasp · Post by **Wasp** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:29 pm

Senor NoirSol wrote:QUOTE (Senor NoirSol @ Oct 11 2016, 03:11 PM) KGJV will analyze the evidence, and will choose the best course of action.

Care to put money on that?

When brought to his attention (6 years ago, now, and all the time in between) he did nothing. Even in the face of evidence, he tells us "I've conducted extended tests on my systems and I've yet to replicate that issue. The miner test on your video is smooth on mine..." which is absolute horse $hit.

Post by **MagisterXF94** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 7:37 pm

call me naive, but i think he will.

KGJV · Post by **KGJV** » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:26 pm

Wasp wrote:QUOTE (Wasp @ Oct 11 2016, 09:29 PM) When brought to his attention (6 years ago, now, and all the time in between) he did nothing.

I wasn't aware of this 6 years ago. I was just informed of this, by you, earlier this year.

I never noticed this nor read about this back then. If you find an old post in these forums talking about this , show me plz but I don't recall any of this.

I'm still not convinced dx9 is the culprit and I still don't see any 'evidence' it is.

'Jumping ships' all over the place is network code issue (directplay) and/or cpu bottleneck somewhere. I don't think it's related to gfx or dx9 (=d3d9 to be precise since dx9 is a large entity including also directplay8).

IIRC Allegiance always has lag/jump issues because of the way it's built. It was designed for old RTC internet connections. On modern broadband/fiber connections there is probably some tuning and changes to do.

Ideally getting ride of DirectPlay and using a more modern netcode would be a first step.

Wasp · Post by **Wasp** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 2:02 am

YOU and Doofus were responsible for this being released. If you didn't know about the problems, it could only be because you had your head in the sand and refused to listen then just as you are doing now. I have pointed you right at the very commit that brought lag, cursor screw-up, and jumping ships which I have been screaming about since 2009.

You don't think it's Dx9 related however, if you were paying attention, you'd have noticed the feedback that others were providing right when that Dx9 alpha was released and running side by side with the Dx7. Now you're asking for proof of such complaints...ok, I'll start digging and once again prove that you are refusing to accept the fact that your Dx9 project was a failure.

You are doing everything possible except considering that it is indeed due to the enormous change that YOU brought with that Dx9 blunder. You say that the stuttering that I provided proof of via video isn't happening on your machine....yet we both know that is complete horse $hit. You are simply lying out of your ass in your fit of denial.

You complained that the Admins are not reacting fast enough with publishing builds even after this blunder was published far before it was ready. That would be ironic if it wasn't so pathetic.

It's not the responsibility of Admins to guarantee your crap gets published just because of the time you put into it. If it's a failure, it has no business being pushed onto the community.

When those who actually are sensitive enough to detect these flaws, it is YOUR duty to pay attention and FIX those flaws.

I am not saying this is a Dx9 "bug", what I am saying is that your Dx9 commit CAUSED this $hit and we've been suffering from it ever since.

Yes, allegiance has always had lag/jump issues just as every other online game however, this is far beyond just lag jumping. You've imposed incredible cursor lag / controller misbehavior and ships doing stuff that nobody has ever seen before. Those right angle turns and the stuttering and controller issues are INDICATIVE of crap coding and to hear you suggest otherwise tells us that you refuse to accept facts shoved right in your face.

KGJV · Post by **KGJV** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 12:39 pm

First, you'll have stop to behaving like a spoiled angry child if you want to have any kind of constructive interaction with me.
2nd, You're not entitled to anything.
3rd, this isn't my job or my duty to do whatsoever.
4th, the dx9 port isn't my work and never has been. I was barely involved in it back then. I do remember we tested it with beta sessions. I don't recall any complains about these issues. I do recall lot of issues with Intel gpu and that delayed the release of the dx9 port. The dev lead back then (dogbones?) decided to publish it at some point.I don't remember huge community complains when R5 was released.

5th, I really really really don't understand the issue(s).I'm sincere here. Call me stupid or dense I don't care. I'm really trying to understand and separate issues.
The way you try to explain things is confusing, I'm sorry but it is for me.

Now if someone else here (NOY YOU) really understand these issues and could explain them clearly may be we can move forward.

Wasp · Post by **Wasp** » Wed Oct 12, 2016 1:52 pm

KGJV wrote:QUOTE (KGJV @ Oct 12 2016, 08:39 AM) First, you'll have stop to behaving like a spoiled angry child if you want to have any kind of constructive interaction with me.
2nd, You're not entitled to anything.
3rd, this isn't my job or my duty to do whatsoever.
4th, the dx9 port isn't my work and never has been. I was barely involved in it back then. I do remember we tested it with beta sessions. I don't recall any complains about these issues. I do recall lot of issues with Intel gpu and that delayed the release of the dx9 port. The dev lead back then (dogbones?) decided to publish it at some point.I don't remember huge community complains when R5 was released.

5th, I really really really don't understand the issue(s).I'm sincere here. Call me stupid or dense I don't care. I'm really trying to understand and separate issues.
The way you try to explain things is confusing, I'm sorry but it is for me.

Now if someone else here (NOY YOU) really understand these issues and could explain them clearly may be we can move forward.

First, I don't want any kind of constructive interaction with you because there is no way you can interact constructively when your knee jerk reaction is to deny seeing or ever hearing or having anything to do with the project that YOU were indeed a part of. Your name is all over that dx9 code, would you like me to provide the number of times you've commented in that commit?

Second, I never claimed to be entitled to anything however, the community is entitled to have the game, given by Microsoft, to remain whole and not bastardized by amateur coders.

Third, it most certainly IS your job and duty to fix or correct the flaws that YOU imposed. You submit crap and then walk away like you had nothing to do with it.

Fourth, what you remember about R5, back then, now, tomorrow, doesn't mean squat because you have a selective memory and magical machines where these things don't happen (even though we know it does). Want to still claim that the stuttering doesn't happen on your machines that you did "extended testing" on?

Fifth, I know you don't understand the issues here. It is more than obvious that it is beyond your capability. Now you protest that I'm explaining things in a confusing way even though I'm uploading photos, videos, repeatable experiments, pointed to the very commit that contains this blunder, provided builds that demonstrate my findings and hand puppets so that even the most ignorant neanderthal can understand this yet somehow you just can't see.

Go work on the keymap,.. it's simple enough and can't screw anyone over.