Sector Overload

jgbaxter · Post by **jgbaxter** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 9:57 pm

As many of you know, Sector Overload (the process whereby you take damage from having too many objects in a specific single sector) was designed with slower internet connection in mind. I'd request Core Designers in their next update to their core to change the level at which Sector Overload occurs, as a guide I'd suggest twice as many objects before overload begins. Doing so will still allow larger games to recieve the Sector Overload though it will not (instantly) kill the 20 bbrs ripping in to a tp2 when the 40 fighters rush them... though will still have effect in most crowded situations albeit mitigated.

Thanks. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

badpazzword · Post by **badpazzword** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:13 pm

jgbaxter wrote:QUOTE (jgbaxter @ Sep 22 2007, 11:57 PM) As many of you know, Sector Overload (the process whereby you take damage from having too many objects in a specific single sector) was designed with slower internet connection in mind. I'd request Core Designers in their next update to their core to change the level at which Sector Overload occurs, as a guide I'd suggest twice as many objects before overload begins. Doing so will still allow larger games to recieve the Sector Overload though it will not (instantly) kill the 20 bbrs ripping in to a tp2 when the 40 fighters rush them... though will still have effect in most crowded situations albeit mitigated.

Thanks. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

jg, the problem is not the client's connection speed: it is capped at 36kbps, no matter how many ships.

The problem is the server's bandwith usage: it increases exponentially for each client in/viewing each server.

So this request should come from all the server administrators, if they feel they can all handle the increased bandwith usage. This is because the limit is stored in the core file, not in the server's configuration, and as such it is a cross-server setting.

Grimmwolf_GB · Post by **Grimmwolf_GB** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:21 pm

EU server is not even close to using its traffic limit.

jgbaxter · Post by **jgbaxter** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:45 pm

This is a core setting, not server side.

There is no way doubling the Sector Overload start will effect any server, since I run a server (usually), I know this and am not the least concerned that it'll make even a noticeable headache. In this modern world, if people are still using dialup to play Alleg, then they will get lag, they'll have to deal I'm afraid. /wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

KGJV · Post by **KGJV** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:37 pm

How the overload is computed:

Values in core that are used for it (actual values for DN 4.60 showed):

BaseClusterCost -36
ClusterDivisor 400
LifepodCost 0.5
TurretCost 0.5
DroneCost 0.5
PlayerCost 1

Every update tick (default is 10 per second), the sector cost is initialized to BaseClusterCost (ClusterCost = BaseClusterCost)
For each lifepod, turret, drone and player controlled ship, the corresponding costs are added to it.

If ClusterCost is negative, there is no sector overload.

If ClusterCost is positive then it's scaled to elapsed time since last update like this:

ClusterCost = ClusterCost * DeltaT / ClusterDivisor

Where DeltaT is the time elapsed (in seconds) since the previous update tick.

Then for each ship in sector, damage is applied like this:

Damage taken = ClustorCost * (Ship max hull + ship shield max strength if shield is mounted).

Collision type damage is applied so DM00 is used.

So the damage done by sector overloaded is :

* scaled to the overload (more ppl, more damage)

* proportionnal to ship total max hitpoints (hull + shield) (aka not proportionnal to current ship hitpoints).

This means that a cruiser and a scout will die after the same time...

This means that a ship with shield mounted will take more damage than a ship with shield unmounted so dismount your shield once its depleted during a sector overload.

Some numbers now:

40 player ships in same sector : ClusterCost = BaseClusterCost + 40 * PlayerCost = -36 + 40*1 = 4

Assuming the server has no stress, it will perform 10 updates every second. So DeltaT = 0.1 seconds

ClusterCost = ClusterCost * DeltaT / ClusterDivisor = 4 * 0.1/400 = 0.001

So every update, each ship will sustain 0.1% of its max hitpoints as damage. That is 1% per second. Means average time to die is 100 seconds.

A scout with sm1 has an average of 200+150=350 max points (+/- faction/tech GAs). So it'll take 3.5 dmg every second.
If it has its shield unmounted, it'll take 2 dmg per sec.

With 50 players, we get 3.5% per second. Average time to die is 28 seconds

With 60 players, we get 6% per second. Average time to die is 16 seconds.

With 80 players, we get 11% per second. Average time to die is 9 seconds.

Gappy · Post by **Gappy** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:45 pm

Unless I get any objections from server administrators, I will remove the sector overload limit on my core. It's a poor solution to the bandwidth problem, and has been abused in the past for unintended reasons, such as killing SBs.

Grimmwolf_GB · Post by **Grimmwolf_GB** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:55 pm

Don't just remove it, up it first. Go to 50 or 60 and see how it works out.

w0dk4 · Post by **w0dk4** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 10:12 pm

The point of sector overload is, once there are so many players in a sector, it gets unplayable because of the bandwith cap.
A patch could solve this problem *hint /mrgreen.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="mrgreen.gif" />

On another note: I dont think sector overload has any value, neither to the gameplay, nor to the server.
Podding all players in a sector is not a good solution, since the players could at least try to compete with the lag instead of just dying (remember, the targeted player always gets good position updates on the client).
I still think we should get rid of it completely.

jgbaxter · Post by **jgbaxter** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:13 pm

Please don't remove it, just increase the onset later. Doubling it should be a good start, then see what happens in 3 months.

Besides, the first time I heard the Sector Boundary and the Sector Overload alerts, they scared the crap out of me, please don't deprive newbies of that fun. /tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":P" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" />

KGJV · Post by **KGJV** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:44 pm

Sector overload wasnt added for gameplay purpose.

But it can be used as a gameplay tactic. So instead of removing it, it's more up to core devs to tune it.
For instance, they could change DM00 for some hulls so that some ships are less vulnerable to collisions and so to sector overload.

Code side, we could change some bits too such as making damage equal for everyone instead of proportionnal to ship max hitpoints. that way stronger ships will survive longer.