Ok Noir, Seriously!

[Shizoku]

Noir, I have talked to quite a few people recently, as well as I have view several posts over the forums. It is the general concensus that carriers are so bloody overpowered it's not even fun anymore. Please, for the sake of some form of ballance, make the carriers go back to sy. This is DN's greatest flaw IMO, please remove it so that we can have fun again.

[Raveen]

I'd rather see some sort of compromise where there are weak carriers under Garrison with true carriers under SY or at very least have Garr based carriers linked to the SY off flag so there's no more carrier spam in small games.

I like seeing carriers relatively often, but only if they are balanced into small-medium sized games.

[Grimmwolf_GB]

I balance them, by not using them as miner offense. I use them for miner d. But most comms use them as attack carrier and that screws up the balance.

[Shizoku]

Use one carrier for d one for a home rip and one to blow the @#(! out the enemies econ.

[Drizzo]

Either or as it stands carriers are too strong for something that's available right off the bat. Carriers should be available after an upgraded garrison and SY must be turned on. Also I think they should have a price bump to say about 7500 - 10000. That makes any commander who buys a carrier take it MORE seriously because they'd have to upgrade their garrison, then throw away another 10k, where as they could have bought a tech base and upgraded that.

[Badger]

They are too strong. I am not sure about the upgraded garr, it could work ok that way. If you have them in upgraded garr, they would be utilized still on occassion, but more costly.

Will they be utilized at all if you put them to SY? It will cost 10k for a techbase, another 25k or so to up it, then 10k-15k for the sy. That becomes quite costly. By the time you get SY, you are more focused on using the cap ships vs using drone carriers.


I like the Garr plan I think. Would work out good. However if they go to the SY, so be it. As long as they are not allowed right off the bat.

[Being]

Carriers to starbase sounds good, with SY turned on.

Well.. BIOS would still be able to get carriers right away.
The faction win percentage says it might be an appropriate perk for them too.
Can pods rip to carriers, and then be picked up right away?

[Rakinite]

Here's what I see wrong with carriers:
1. Each one is too cheap(base cost of 5k)
2. You don't need to research anything, they come free in the garrison.
3. They can rip to sectors.
3a. Since they have util hull, the carrier can survive long enough to rip out in almost any case where a normal drone would be %@#&ed.

As for solutions:
1. Increase the cost of building each carrier, maybe to 7.5-10k.
2. The only carrier that should be in the garrison is a light carrier. It should cost money to research, even if a small amount. You would be able to upgrade to standard/enh if the SY tag was turned on. The enh carriers though, would actually be in the shipyard, in the form of current attack carriers.
3. Although a carrier should still remain SR, their ability to ripcord should be nerfed or removed entirely. If not removed entirely, it should take perhaps 60 seconds instead of 30.
3a. Change the armor class for the carrier drones. What appear to be the best candidate is Heavy armor, which appears to be used for the SY carriers. The only problem that I forsee right now is the damage it would take from disruptor type weapons(DM03)

Ideally, the carrier should be closer to a mobile dockable/transferable base, although that require code changes.

[Badger]

QUOTE (Being @ Aug 9 2006, 10:12 AM) Can pods rip to carriers, and then be picked up right away?

I do not think so, I think pods require a tp. That would be a bit cheesy to have pods rippable to carrier for insta pu's....lol

It is possible right now...right?! /mrgreen.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="mrgreen.gif" />

[Badger]

QUOTE (Rakinite @ Aug 9 2006, 10:37 AM) Here's what I see wrong with carriers:
1. Each one is too cheap(base cost of 5k)
2. You don't need to research anything, they come free in the garrison.
3. They can rip to sectors.
3a. Since they have util hull, the carrier can survive long enough to rip out in almost any case where a normal drone would be %@#&ed.

As for solutions:
1. Increase the cost of building each carrier, maybe to 7.5-10k.
2. The only carrier that should be in the garrison is a light carrier. It should cost money to research, even if a small amount. You would be able to upgrade to standard/enh if the SY tag was turned on. The enh carriers though, would actually be in the shipyard, in the form of current attack carriers.
3. Although a carrier should still remain SR, their ability to ripcord should be nerfed or removed entirely. If not removed entirely, it should take perhaps 60 seconds instead of 30.
3a. Change the armor class for the carrier drones. What appear to be the best candidate is Heavy armor, which appears to be used for the SY carriers. The only problem that I forsee right now is the damage it would take from disruptor type weapons(DM03)

Ideally, the carrier should be closer to a mobile dockable/transferable base, although that require code changes.

imo, you are trying to make too many changes to the carriers at once. If you move it to the SY, it will not get utilized as much. Why spend 10k on a drone carrier when you can put it towards a frigate or something that kills bases and win the game?

Carriers, imo, are tools. they are mid-game tech that provide a platform for ships to operate from. Allowing them to be utilized 10-20 min into the game means the other team has had time to get some sort of tech up and to expand some. They can properly defend against the carriers, which still allow for the enmy to utilize them well. If they go Sup or Tac, Carriers are still very useful for the rest of the game if you get them early on. Delaying the time in which a team can get them is good. Making it so they cannot be utilized until a team has SY is basically taking them out of the game.