Rix Heavy Scout Discussion

[Xeretov]

QUOTE (Adaven @ Jul 6 2010, 08:33 PM) Yeah I was talking about just 1 hvy scout type available at loadout. I figured there'd be some kinks with the sig, didn't realize there was a regen nerf in there as well.

Use ICE to compare next time.

QUOTE Lower regen does hurt bomber/htt runs, but on the other hand, you'll be able to rip more scouts in at will.[/quote]
What about miners or cons? Con pushing especially. You'd be better off not researching hvy scouts at all if you plan to use anything that requires extended nanning. While that would certainly solve the heavy scout problem, I don't think its the ideal way to do so.

QUOTE Sig is likely going to be more tricky. TP2 would be much harder at current SR sig. Maybe a reduction in sig would be in order. How much? I have no idea.[/quote]
This returns to my point about SR scouts being hard to find. They shouldn't be, because of how much of a bonus it is to be an SR scout in the first place. Pros: Is SR capable. Cons: Costs money (removed in your idea) and is easier to find than normal scout. Also the energy nerf, but thats there more to limit its SR capability.

QUOTE I'm thinking you're probably best off by just making the current hvy SR the only hvy available and seeing how that shakes things up before trying to second guess how to fix it completely.[/quote]
That sounds like a really, really bad idea given that significant issues have been raised with your idea but no solutions given.

[Jimen]

QUOTE (Adaven @ Jul 6 2010, 08:33 PM) Right now you are lucky to see 1-2 people still in SR's when hvy's are up. That's not going to change much as long as there is a 2nd scout type available with more powerful pilot weaponry, regardless of the price of SR's.

You've identified the reason for low usage of hvy SRs, but are barking up the completely wrong tree in terms of solution. Knock the hvy scout's armament down so it's not obviously so much better than the SR hvy scout, and I think you'll find that SR usage will rise proportionally, because the choice won't be so obviously clear. Why fly an unstealthy gat-armed @#(!box with a big target painted on its ass when you can fly essentially the same ship but with half the sig and a front mini-AC? Notice that I say "proportionally", because Rix hvy scouts won't be bought nearly as often if you remove their viability as a primary techpath by bringing down their firepower in line with the rest, so usage as a whole will go down.

Granted, none of that matters much, since post-techbase SR usage will always be low as long as Exp is basically the Rix techpath.

[Terran]

DON'T TAKE AWAY MY LOVE FROM ME

why do they need a nerf? 37 THOUSAND credits spent and only 20k (gunships) to counter and we're screaming for a nerf?

i don't see a reason to continue playing this game if my dearest is taken away from me

[NightRychune]

you just need to play more giga vs giga games with only si rocks enabled.

I like Adaven's idea of making hvy SR scouts free, if they weren't so expensive I'd say it'd be an interesting way to perk rix sup (which I feel is underpowered atm)

[Clay_Pigeon]

QUOTE (NightRychune @ Jul 7 2010, 03:29 AM) I like Adaven's idea of making hvy SR scouts free, if they weren't so expensive I'd say it'd be an interesting way to perk rix sup (which I feel is underpowered atm)

Night, I usually worship the ground you crap on, but free heavy SR scouts is absolute crazy talk. For $500 (1/10th the cost of a carrier) you get something that has

1) Higher Speed
2) Lower Sig
3) Higher scan
4) A turret and prox ability
5) Only slightly less energy (1800 vs 2000)
6) 2.6x faster recharge rate, giving it an overall HIGHER rip capacity

Put 2 hvy SR scouts in a sector, and you can support 12 figs/scouts ripping into the sector over 30 seconds. Who needs to tp2 a miner or galv run?

[Broodwich]

do people do that anyway? if tp2 is up its generally being used to get to the enemy techbase and kill it with fbs which are cheap as hell
oh, and dont forget you paid 27.5k to get these ships. for that money you could put a carrier in every sector the enemy has

[Makida]

QUOTE (Broodwich @ Jul 8 2010, 02:38 PM) do people do that anyway?

Yes. That's not to say it's necessarily a good idea, but I've seen TP2s used for galving runs on more than one occasion.

[HSharp]

QUOTE (Broodwich @ Jul 8 2010, 07:38 PM) for that money you could put a carrier in every sector the enemy has

Only 4 sectors, 5 if you are Jimmy or w/e drone settings are set at.

[cashto]

QUOTE (Clay_Pigeon @ Jul 8 2010, 11:29 AM) Night, I usually worship the ground you crap on, but free heavy SR scouts is absolute crazy talk. For $500 (1/10th the cost of a carrier) you get something that has

1) Higher Speed
2) Lower Sig
3) Higher scan
4) A turret and prox ability
5) Only slightly less energy (1800 vs 2000)
6) 2.6x faster recharge rate, giving it an overall HIGHER rip capacity

Put 2 hvy SR scouts in a sector, and you can support 12 figs/scouts ripping into the sector over 30 seconds. Who needs to tp2 a miner or galv run?

The man has a point. Time to jack heavy SR scouts to $5k apiece.

[Koln]

QUOTE (Clay_Pigeon @ Jul 8 2010, 08:29 PM) Night, I usually worship the ground you crap on, but free heavy SR scouts is absolute crazy talk. For $500 (1/10th the cost of a carrier) you get something that has

1) Higher Speed
2) Lower Sig
3) Higher scan
4) A turret and prox ability
5) Only slightly less energy (1800 vs 2000)
6) 2.6x faster recharge rate, giving it an overall HIGHER rip capacity

Put 2 hvy SR scouts in a sector, and you can support 12 figs/scouts ripping into the sector over 30 seconds. Who needs to tp2 a miner or galv run?

If the front AC gun is removed from hvy scouts, they'll stop being used as a replacement for a first real tech (as the typical rush does) and will instead be used more or less the same as the other hvy scouts are. That means that by the time a team gets hvy scouts it's either mining the whole map (and therefore it's a justified cheese IMO) or have done all the other stages of a sup team (including galv runs) and is going for tp2, thus buying hvy scouts for an improve scout to sneak to the enemy bases.

TLDR i don't think all the points in your list are a big deal. Yes, you could still rush hvy scouts and have mobile free carriers but your econ will die while you're still ripping basic figs to die to the enemy enh/adv tech.