Belts Tac

Adaven · Post by **Adaven** » Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:32 pm

so is a slight nerf to belts' sfs/sbs energy (or regen) out of the question?

Your_Persona · Post by **Your_Persona** » Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:25 am

Whats wrong with belts having a good Tac? Is that not allowed or something? Must IC and EXP always pwn?
Or can you all not figure a way to beat Belts tac?
Or do pickup games just suck cause no one probes?

Belters tac is not to strong. Your teams are to weak. /ninja.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":ninja:" border="0" alt="ninja.gif" />

Clay_Pigeon · Post by **Clay_Pigeon** » Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:13 pm

Belts Tac is just the flavor of the month. For the longest time last year, you couldn't log on to DN without playing GT Sup vs Dreg Exp. Other strategies to gain popularity in recent times are Giga Tac, Rix hvy scout rush, Nix Van Rush or TF Exp. People find out that a particular strategy works, play it over and over again until everyone else figures out how to counter it.

All of the standard counters to tac apply to Belters, and you get a few counters that take advantage of some of Belters's weaknesses (like high sig).

Now, maybe we should be talking about global nerfs to Tac...for instance, hunter is such a powerful missile, maybe it should be $5000 (the same cost as the tech needed to counter it)......or not. That's an entirely different discussion.

-T

PS. Giving belters SBS lt boost isn't a terrible idea though /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

takingarms1 · Post by **takingarms1** » Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:17 pm

I definately don't think Tac needs a nerf.

Anybody remember when even lrm3's sucked and you'd have to really work to make them connect more than 50% of the time? And the slow, slow lrm reload times? SFs used to SUCK so much for defending back then. Now there's a good balance - once tac gets adv tech it becomes much harder to bomb them (though still easier than bombing versus any of the other adv tech paths). Tac is nice and good right now. If it feels too strong, I suspect it's because people don't know how (or don't want) to defend miners.

guitarism · Post by **guitarism** » Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:25 pm

ACtaully, Pigeon has it kinda of right. I think i'm being unfair to Belt's tac, I think it might be tac in general. The neccesary devices to defend against tac, IE cm2/3 are too exspenisve vs the price of what they are defending against. Either Make CM same price overall as the Hunter, or increase Hunter price.

Though I do like the idea of a slight overall increase in tac prices. That would be nice.

Clay_Pigeon · Post by **Clay_Pigeon** » Sun Jul 09, 2006 1:34 am

takingarms1 wrote:QUOTE (takingarms1 @ Jul 8 2006, 01:17 PM) Anybody remember when even lrm3's sucked and you'd have to really work to make them connect more than 50% of the time? And the slow, slow lrm reload times? SFs used to SUCK so much for defending back then. Now there's a good balance - once tac gets adv tech it becomes much harder to bomb them (though still easier than bombing versus any of the other adv tech paths). Tac is nice and good right now. If it feels too strong, I suspect it's because people don't know how (or don't want) to defend miners.

I agree that Tac doesn't necessarily need a nerf capability-wise. Right now, adv tac is strong, but not invincible...just like the other tech paths. However, tac (specifically hunters) may need a cost nerf, in recognition of the fact that DN hunters are a "utility-knife" kind of weapon....not to the extent that miniguns are, but hunters are effective vs a wide variety of targets (and the counters cost twice that of the weapon).

takingarms1 · Post by **takingarms1** » Sun Jul 09, 2006 12:58 pm

Ah, I see what you're saying clay, but I'm not sure that I can agree. The problem is, once you buy the counters, the lrms become significantly less effective. At the ranges that SFs normally fire from, you've got time to drop 2 or sometimes 3 counters, and with the way things are set up now, odds are that one of them will spoof the missile. So if the pilot is smart and brought lots of extra counters, it's going to take the SF a while to kill him. If you make counters easier / faster to get, you end up nerfing tac too much IMHO.

BootHappy · Post by **BootHappy** » Sun Jul 09, 2006 1:17 pm

What counters do you use? I'm lucking if I can get one off per missile.

Rakinite · Post by **Rakinite** » Sun Jul 09, 2006 2:05 pm

I use whatever CMs the comm gives us. I think against tac that's usually cm2 or 3, both of which do an acceptable job against hunts. Do note: Hunters have a high base sig, which will interfere with your cloaking to some degree. If hunters are out of balance, I would increase their base sig.

The Master of Stupid Witty Sayings wrote:QUOTE (The Master of Stupid Witty Sayings @ Jul 9 2006 10:02 AM)Sure I'll let you use your utility knife, as long as it acts as a spotlight

Dengaroth · Post by **Dengaroth** » Sun Jul 09, 2006 11:02 pm

takingarms1 wrote:QUOTE (takingarms1 @ Jul 9 2006, 02:58 PM) Ah, I see what you're saying clay, but I'm not sure that I can agree. The problem is, once you buy the counters, the lrms become significantly less effective. At the ranges that SFs normally fire from, you've got time to drop 2 or sometimes 3 counters, and with the way things are set up now, odds are that one of them will spoof the missile.

Guess what - what you just wrote holds for CM1 just as well as it does for CM2.

(the above table is calculated from DN 04.45 values, using equations straight from the source code).