Res1

Alien51 · Post by **Alien51** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:20 pm

I'd like to see Res1 used more, I don't think I've ever seen it used actually. People just wait till Res3 is up then go. Right now Res1 is within Garr tech, yet it can't be used until you get Hvybbrs or SY. Wtf? Shouldn't these techs increment up? Why wait till you have everything before they're useful?

I would like Res (at least Res1) to be able to be used by basic Bbrs.

I think this would be a step towards more interesting and fairer gameplay.

HSharp · Post by **HSharp** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 3:38 pm

Alien51 wrote:QUOTE (Alien51 @ Mar 7 2011, 03:20 PM) Right now Res1 is within Garr tech, yet it can't be used until you get Hvybbrs or SY. Wtf? Shouldn't these techs increment up? Why wait till you have everything before they're useful?

As far as I can recall SY doesn't need starbase as a requirement so it's fine for caps. Res1 is pretty powerful for bombers if you can get em before enh tech gets up so it's understandable why its only for Hvy Bombers and SY to delay it.

Elzam_ · Post by **Elzam_** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 4:14 pm

How does Res1 being used more lead to fairer gameplay? And on bbrs?

RoboTel · Post by **RoboTel** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:58 pm

It certainly leads to more diverse gameplay, though I am not sure it would be more balanced.

Yes, SY doesn't need starbase, but I can agree that it isn't desirable to have a literally useless tech sitting there. I am not saying it should go on a bomber, but perhaps it should be locked until something that can use it is at least researchable. Admittedly, it isn't as though there are newbies, but I dislike the concept of something that is 100% newbie trap.

SpaceJunk · Post by **SpaceJunk** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:05 pm

What range/damage would you deem acceptable for a free Res 0?

Even a harmless Res would make the other team wonder about the chances, I guess.

Jersy · Post by **Jersy** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:08 pm

I was thinking the same, but for seismics. No devel required, mountable on basic bombers. I would bet that if they are ever used now, it is to clear a sector from rocks suspicious of becoming and ideal object to conceal a TP drop. Or just for the plain fun of blowing stuff up. It might be nice if they could be effectively used - for example - for killing He3 rocks the enemy would be mining at...

Makida · Post by **Makida** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:03 pm

The few instances when I've seen teams actively killing rocks, it was to deny the enemy tech rocks... And in that capacity, it's easy to imagine seismics becoming quite overpowered if they are too easy to get too early in the game. O_o

Same for res. Yes, it would be nice if it was used more often, but it's something that can be quite powerful if made accessible too easily, too early in a game. At the very least, if it is to be made any easier to use early in game, it should be removed from the floating treasures...

LANS · Post by **LANS** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:19 pm

@Jersy: Although blowing up the enemy's He3 rocks with seismics is possible, it takes a lot of missiles and is fairly slow. Regular asteroids aren't as hard to kill, but its still faster and often just as effective to probe your own rocks, and then have what would be your bombing crew chase down TP2 scouts instead.

Seismics fall under the "almost always a waste of money" category, useful for specific things but the money is often better spent on other stuff.

Res falls under the "rarely useful" category. I've seen res used three times in about 800 games that I've played. Twice it was mounted on frigates to clear a turtling team, the last time it was used with heavy bombers. The frigates worked, the bombers just managed to blow up their own nan trains and then died to ints who were waiting outside of res range on the other side.

Alien, making res mountable on reg bombers will just result in people wasting an extra $1000 on a bomb run which fails when they blow up their own nans. Its really only practical for capship use. Res is in garr (not starbase) so a shipyard team can use it without spending to upgrade the garrison.

Alien51 · Post by **Alien51** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 4:40 pm

@LANS:
Claiming that a people won't know how to use the tech as an argument against the tech is just silly. Ya it's different, people will like it and learn. It's really not that different anyhow, I've seen people use them with Hvybbrs and nans just fine.
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I don't know why everyone is thinking that I think you need Starbase for Res1, I clearly stated "Hvybbrs or SY".

How would this make fairer gameplay? That's a question no one can really answer, since "fairer" is subjective. I suppose when I said it it meant that it would help teams fight Exp teams.

PS.) With XC03 out now TTs can cap tech bases rather readily. This would be a step towards balancing that.

Jersy · Post by **Jersy** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:19 pm

girlyboy wrote:QUOTE (girlyboy @ Mar 8 2011, 12:03 AM) The few instances when I've seen teams actively killing rocks, it was to deny the enemy tech rocks... And in that capacity, it's easy to imagine seismics becoming quite overpowered if they are too easy to get too early in the game. O_o

Well, actually you bring up an interesting point and personally I think that killing techrocks would make for a good alternative strategy. You definitely shouldn't be able to rush the other team's first tech con and blow it's techrock before it plants though... I was thinking more along the lines of invading the enemy's forward mining sector and kill all the He3 rich rocks just when they built a ref there, which then becomes useless. Or intercepting the backup techbase con and blowing it's techrock. Or just blowing up techrocks in late game, to prevent comebacks.

LANS wrote:QUOTE (LANS @ Mar 8 2011, 12:19 AM) @Jersy: Although blowing up the enemy's He3 rocks with seismics is possible, it takes a lot of missiles and is fairly slow. Regular asteroids aren't as hard to kill, but its still faster and often just as effective to probe your own rocks, and then have what would be your bombing crew chase down TP2 scouts instead.

Seismics fall under the "almost always a waste of money" category, useful for specific things but the money is often better spent on other stuff.

And that is precisely why I was thinking about making seismics more accesible/usable. Not too much to become cheese though. Just enough to make things like aforementioned He3 and Techrock killing into usable strategies. Not totally OP super-strategies, but more like equally effective alternative ones. Just my opinion though.