Shipyard & CC_07
These same arguments work rather well for putting He-yield GAs into SY. For some reason I'm uneasy about the specmine-SY.Raveen wrote:QUOTE (Raveen @ Aug 13 2009, 12:04 AM) yeah, SY is not a miner replacement. It just means that you can keep the flow of caps coming whilst still working through the tech tree.
<bp|> Maybe when I grow up I can be a troll like PsycH
<bp|> or an obsessive compulsive paladin of law like Adept
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TurkeyXIII
- Posts: 1460
- Joined: Thu Dec 06, 2007 3:18 am
- Location: Melbourne, Aus
http://www.freeallegiance.org/forums/index...showtopic=26049
Might be worth a read as it's a discussion of rebalancing A+ SY.
Might be worth a read as it's a discussion of rebalancing A+ SY.
Spidey: Can't think of a reason I'd need to know anything
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dingusdangus
- Posts: 109
- Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2008 4:44 pm
- Location: Philadelphia, PA
I know I am still pretty new to this game, so feel free to ignore and/or rip apart my ideas.
From my experience the problems with SY are two fold:
1) It is too hit or miss. You have these massive devastating ships that get oblitereated by dis/galv. Unless you are already winning badly and super rich, by the time you get a SY and super sweet caps, they have their Sup and your @#(! is useless.
2) It does not function well as a stand alone tech because it is slow, expensive, and needs another tech base to build. It is also not very usefull as end game tech, because it makes much more sense to get sbs/figbees/HTT. Geting a second techbase instead of SY also give you the benefit of usefull GAs while you work towards your end tech.
It might be interesting to make SY a standalone tech:
1) Give it a basic free GS-esque ship with normal/enh/adv versions that can dock anywhere.
2) Give the GS-esque ship better manueverability, speed, a smaller size, maybe a slightly better hull, but significantly worse turrets (less damage and range). In other words, make it more like the other tech's small ships - less reliant on superior range, and better able to perform normal small ship functions, but still unique and turret based
3) Make its tech tree mimick that of other tech - eliminate light/med/heavy instead just SY->drydock. SY gives you the chance to research normal/enh GS and drydock allows you to research adv. GS
4) It might also help to hook SY up with some usefull GAs
5) Make SY buyable without having another tech base up.
6) Have the large SY caps remain as SY's end game base blowing up tech, researchable only at the Drydock, Expensive-ish to research, and each costly to buy. Remove the useless ships (frieghter) and maybe corv (because it would be too similar to SY's basic ship). I think balancing these big captials would also be easier if they had a lot less hull/shield but signifincalty reduce the dis/galv bonus. How these big SY caps should be researchable Im not sure though, either you research each ship individually, or maybe you research predefined packs that come with a couple caps in a theme ( ie attack, defense, support as someone else already suggested)
That is all. I know I have probably said a couple stupid things, so my bad, but I think the concept has some promise. I have also obviously not given any numbers to these ideas, because...well...they would be wrong.
Thanks
Dingus
From my experience the problems with SY are two fold:
1) It is too hit or miss. You have these massive devastating ships that get oblitereated by dis/galv. Unless you are already winning badly and super rich, by the time you get a SY and super sweet caps, they have their Sup and your @#(! is useless.
2) It does not function well as a stand alone tech because it is slow, expensive, and needs another tech base to build. It is also not very usefull as end game tech, because it makes much more sense to get sbs/figbees/HTT. Geting a second techbase instead of SY also give you the benefit of usefull GAs while you work towards your end tech.
It might be interesting to make SY a standalone tech:
1) Give it a basic free GS-esque ship with normal/enh/adv versions that can dock anywhere.
2) Give the GS-esque ship better manueverability, speed, a smaller size, maybe a slightly better hull, but significantly worse turrets (less damage and range). In other words, make it more like the other tech's small ships - less reliant on superior range, and better able to perform normal small ship functions, but still unique and turret based
3) Make its tech tree mimick that of other tech - eliminate light/med/heavy instead just SY->drydock. SY gives you the chance to research normal/enh GS and drydock allows you to research adv. GS
4) It might also help to hook SY up with some usefull GAs
5) Make SY buyable without having another tech base up.
6) Have the large SY caps remain as SY's end game base blowing up tech, researchable only at the Drydock, Expensive-ish to research, and each costly to buy. Remove the useless ships (frieghter) and maybe corv (because it would be too similar to SY's basic ship). I think balancing these big captials would also be easier if they had a lot less hull/shield but signifincalty reduce the dis/galv bonus. How these big SY caps should be researchable Im not sure though, either you research each ship individually, or maybe you research predefined packs that come with a couple caps in a theme ( ie attack, defense, support as someone else already suggested)
That is all. I know I have probably said a couple stupid things, so my bad, but I think the concept has some promise. I have also obviously not given any numbers to these ideas, because...well...they would be wrong.
Thanks
Dingus
If SY was going to be a separate techpath, it might be interesting to make a GS clone for SY only that has a faster rip time but can only dock at SY, and is free (or maybe $1 so commanders can keep people from spamming 'em instead of jumping on the turrets).
Don't find fault, find a remedy; anybody can complain.
Cookie Monster wrote:QUOTE (Cookie Monster @ Apr 1 2009, 09:35 PM) But I don't read the forums I only post.
There's something I'd like: A unique starting ship for every factions instead of "light" versions of existing ships. There could be an enh version in Starbase and GS could then be moved to SY.phoenix1 wrote:QUOTE (phoenix1 @ Aug 17 2009, 06:23 PM) If SY was going to be a separate techpath, it might be interesting to make a GS clone for SY only that has a faster rip time but can only dock at SY, and is free (or maybe $1 so commanders can keep people from spamming 'em instead of jumping on the turrets).
I disagree with SY paydays since I really don't see any advantages. If you want people to buy more caps, lowering the price of capital ships achieve the same thing(With more scaling problems). SY shouldn't give money that could be used for other techpaths.
With a more classic tech tree style, I think a lot of problems would be fixed. One of the main problem with SY is that with the light/med/hvy/etc class system, getting a decent cap out is too expensive. Light class usually face enh tech and med class ends up having to go against Adv tech. With the removal of the class system, it would be much easier to get stronger capital ships out before Adv tech.
How I'd like to see SY:
-A maxed out SY should be the most expensive, but also most effective way of "ending the game"
-SY power should be: Enh Tech<Basic SY<Adv Tech<Drydock.
-I like the feeling of SY when capital ships can decide of the outcome of the game by a single strike. I would miss it if it was changed.
-I'd like it(the idea isn't from me) if the best way to counter capital ships was anti-capital ship caps.
Another idea:
Make Drydock unlock an upgraded version of basic capital ships. You get a SY, buy MFs, then you get to use MFs. You upgrade to a Drydock and you get Adv MFs. I think it would lower the step between basic SY and drydock. IIRC, In MS days, you needed 25k for a drydock and an extra 15k for cruisers. So to upgrade MFs into cruisers, you needed 40k. with that proposition, a SY team would get benefits from their drydock after paying 25k which would help to make it better imo.
Edit: About sup, I know it has been discussed often, but it just shouldn't completely destroy caps like it does now. I don't mind Sup being the strongest way to counter SY, but a Maxed out SY should have a decent chance vs sup.
Last edited by Vlymoxyd on Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Hey ding,dingusdangus wrote:QUOTE (dingusdangus @ Aug 17 2009, 05:59 PM) I know I am still pretty new to this game, so feel free to ignore and/or rip apart my ideas.
just wanted to say don't ever feel you can't say your ideas just because you are newer than some others. I am happy you put more thought into what you said than people who have been here far longer!
Your ideas were quite interesting as well.
Anyway I am waiting for CC_06 to be pushed via Auto update - and once thats done we will get the ball rolling on this ye landlubbers
I'm sorry I don't remember any of it. For you the day spideycw graced your squad with utter destruction was the most important day of your life. But for me, it was Sunday
Idanmel wrote:QUOTE (Idanmel @ Mar 19 2012, 05:54 AM) I am ashamed for all the drama I caused, I have much to learn on how to behave when things don't go my way.
My apologies.