He3 rock capacities and miners

Vlymoxyd · Post by **Vlymoxyd** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:33 pm

I think it's too long to post on the giga thread, but phoenix brought up good pointd about giga miners.

I ressurected my excell sheet from my garbage bin and I'll post it here.

Without he3 regen and on the most standard settings(hihigher, 1.0), look at the $/trip value:

Efficiency
Faction capacity $/ rocks $/full load $/trip miner/rock rock/miner $ extra cap $ left rock $ 2nd rock TTM global
Gigacorp 112,5 5000 9000 5000 1,8 56% 4000 0 4000 62,5 80%
TF 49,5 5000 3960 3960 0,792 126% 0 1040 0 24,75 79%
Dreg 67,5 6750 7290 6750 1,08 93% 540 0 540 96,15384615 92%
IC 67,5 5000 5400 5000 1,08 93% 400 0 400 73,52941176 92%
Bios 90 5000 7200 5000 1,44 69% 2200 0 2200 62,5 56%
Belters 72 6250 7200 6250 1,152 87% 950 0 950 104,1666667 85%
GT 90 4750 6840 4750 1,44 69% 2090 0 2090 78,125 56%
Rixian 90 5000 7200 5000 1,44 69% 2200 0 2200 62,5 56%

Currently, IC, Dreg and Belters lower capacity isn't a disadvantage on STANDARD money/map settings, I think it's a problem as well.

Right now, an IC miner(0.75) will bring as much money as a giga(1.25) one. Giga can sometime mine 2 rocks, but since they can't dry up the 2nd one and that they have to travel extra distance, it's not a huge advantage(At least, considering that giga is supposed to be an economic superpower).

What I'd like is to allow a 1.0 miner to have a capacity equal to the he3 of a rock on standard settings(again, 1.0 hihigher).
I'm not proposing this for balance reasons, but because I'd like to be able to taste the flavour of the different factions of allegiance.

To do this, change the miner base capacity to 62,5 units(from 90) and raise the he3 unit value to 115,2(from 80) and multiply the mining speed of every faction by 0.7.
Full miners will bring exactly the same amount of money, but on standard settings, factions with capacities disadvantages won't be full(like they are now). Factions with capacities advantage will be able to benefit from he3 regen.

Or, for a purely esthetical improvement over the last proposition:
72 units/rocks, he3 value: 100 and divide every mining speed by 1.152. It'd be easier to calculate the he3 value of a sector if the he3 value was 100. there's like no drawback for the end-user.

I also don't think that the change should be brough up all at once. Change it slowy.

Edit: To get the proper values/rocks, it'd be : Total money 2084 for the base change and 2400 for the esthetic one.

Death3D · Post by **Death3D** » Thu Jul 09, 2009 11:27 pm

Edit: Everything I can do, Andon can do better. Andon can do everything better than me

Andon · Post by **Andon** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 12:37 am

Here.
CODEFaction Capacity $/ rocks $/full load $/trip miner/rock rock/miner $extra cap $left rock $2nd rock TTM global
Gigacorp 112,5 5000 9000 5000 1,8 56% 4000 0 4000 62,5 80%
TF 49,5 5000 3960 3960 0,792 126% 0 1040 0 24,7 79%
Dreg 67,5 6750 7290 6750 1,08 93% 540 0 540 96,1 92%
IC 67,5 5000 5400 5000 1,08 93% 400 0 400 73,5 92%
Bios 90 5000 7200 5000 1,44 69% 2200 0 2200 62,5 56%
Belters 72 6250 7200 6250 1,152 87% 950 0 950 104,2 85%
GT 90 4750 6840 4750 1,44 69% 2090 0 2090 78,1 56%
Rixian 90 5000 7200 5000 1,44 69% 2200 0 2200 62,5 56%

Always do it in something like Notepad. The forum font isn't evenly spaced like notepad is

Vlymoxyd · Post by **Vlymoxyd** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:31 am

Nice, that's better!

Post by **pkk** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 10:30 am

Vlymoxyd wrote:QUOTE (Vlymoxyd @ Jul 9 2009, 07:33 PM) Currently, IC, Dreg and Belters lower capacity isn't a disadvantage on STANDARD money/map settings, I think it's a problem as well.

Now think about it why people call it "STANDARD".

Post by **zombywoof** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 10:41 am

Vlymoxyd wrote:QUOTE (Vlymoxyd @ Jul 9 2009, 10:33 AM) To do this, change the miner base capacity to 62,5 units(from 90) and raise the he3 unit value to 115,2(from 80) and multiply the mining speed of every faction by 0.7.
Full miners will bring exactly the same amount of money,

Yes, but one rock now gives MORE money. As an example, Bios can easily get AT off of 8 rocks. Now Bios gets AT off of 6 rocks (actually, if it was 8 it would now be 5.6). In other words, on hi higher Bios only needs to mine its home and techbase sector to have AT.

If we're going to change miner base capacity, don't change yield (or He3 base value) to "compensate" because that makes it EASIER to get AT, and as it is it may take two sectors on "standard" settings to get AT. Making He worth more (and consequently giving more money to commanders) makes econ idiot proof. We do not want econ to be idiot proof, we want it to be the OPPOSITE of idiot proof (except miner AI, but that's core change).

I don't necessarily disagree with the concept, but I do disagree strongly with increasing yield across the board.

Vlymoxyd · Post by **Vlymoxyd** » Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:23 pm

I wanted to suggest something that allowed everything to stay the same beside for factions with lower capacities, but I now realize that you need to choose a base to use to decide how much he3 a rock and a 1.0 miner can hold.

The more I think about it, the more I think you're right. Instead of upping the yield so that 1.0 miners get their current full load of 7.2k on 1.0 setting(instead of getting it at 1.35), keep the same yield and on 1.0 settings, they'll bring as much money as they do now(5k). I originally though it'd be a nerf on 1.0 settings, but it is not. Higher money settings will just mean that there's more he3 to scrap.

I also think that he3 regen shouldn't be forgotten. Miners currently bring a little bit more than 5k on 1.0 settings and I think that that they should still do after a change(6k sounds like a nice flat number)