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Did anyone understand what I meant? May have done some bad wording.

Basically, you get the Expansion - you research ints. You then have access to ints, and light ints, but light ints are overridden by ints. Light ints, however, do not require the expansion once researched. So if the Expansion is destroyed, they're like bombers - you can still use them (they're just light ints rather than regular ints)

Basic Figs would make more sense since they're a multi-role craft. But, I don't like anything that makes the factions too similar.

Thumbs-down from me.

diversity is fine, but only if it doesn't become a sizable advantage (lt ints vs giga scouts, yeah, your gonna lose that one).

There's always another alternative though, that i had considered once, where rather then giving a free 'starter' ship, you just make a "lt ship" research (short time, low cost) for each ship type. Then you are given the option of getting lt ints for escorting cons, figs for ripping around to carriers or Rix SR's, and even lt sfs, or a 'combination' depending on what kind of strategy you plan to use. The light versions of course are quite underpowered in comparison to enh/adv tech, but can allow for different opening strategies other then one limited to the ship your faction gets at the start, and the ability to retain a lt ship even if your tech is lost.

Or, you could even apply the above but include the free starter ships like normal from the start, and make the other ships optional.

Of course, i'm probably just spouting gibberish here, so feel free to ignore me.

i would love to see either giga or tf with starting lt sfs, maybe get free snipers for tf? or starting srp? but definitely not all factions with lt ints, that would be almost as giving them all the same speed, because once they all have lt ints, people will think every opening should have the same chance (that´s the most important concept here: is every opening going to have the same chance? my vote is no, let's try achieving balance through diversity, even if it's harder at first)

This is the kind of thing where a "Core Faction" has a benefit in terms of establishing a standard. Let's say that it's been determined that the Core Faction starts out with basic scout, basic fig, basic (lt) int. When balancing other factions against the baseline, you could take lt ints away from Faction X as a nerf because you feel that their perk of [whatever] offsets it. Or you can give Faction Y a standard int because their cons only hold 75% helium compared to the Core Faction (as an example). You can make each faction maintain it's traditional uniqueness while balancing it against the Core Faction.

As a comparison, think of some of those Role Playing type games where Human is neither perked nor nerfed. Dwarves are stronger and have more hit points, but can't move as fast, Elves have lower hitpoints but use magic better, and so on.

This may make multi-team games more viable, too, as different factions can more easily complement each other. Possibly. Random thought. /mrgreen.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="mrgreen.gif" />

My biggest problem with the opening is that lt ints can easily catch up to a con whereas figs are screwed (except rix of course). Figs can't even get out of their home sector fast without using more than one "bucket" of fuel. So you can either
-accept that these are faction differences which are compensated for by later game advantages
-give everyone the same type of ship (rix is far better off with figs because of ripping and extra gunmount)
-boost opening figs (and likely the carryovers to enh and adv)
-nerf lt ints

Personally I'd like the beginning to be more fun and not dread the opening on certain factions.

That said, I remember a quote I read quite some time ago when someone interviewed a game developer. He said "players know what they like, they do NOT know what they want." Best of luck to you guys in developing this thing. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

MadAccountant wrote:QUOTE (MadAccountant @ Apr 25 2008, 03:35 PM) My biggest problem with the opening is that lt ints can easily catch up to a con whereas figs are screwed (except rix of course). Figs can't even get out of their home sector fast without using more than one "bucket" of fuel. So you can either
-accept that these are faction differences which are compensated for by later game advantages
-give everyone the same type of ship (rix is far better off with figs because of ripping and extra gunmount)
-boost opening figs (and likely the carryovers to enh and adv)
-nerf lt ints

-delay your con
-build a carrier
-build short
-etc

The choice of Fig vs LtInt actually gives each of the factions some distinctive features, though. Generally I think most of the factions that have starting figs, have them for a reason and are more interesting for it. Rix figs are paired with SR scouts. Belter figs can nan, and belt nanfigs are a pretty big part of belt's early game con d and bbr rushes. Bios figs can drop mines, also, Bios s very likely to have a homerip very early in the game.

If the concern is to make losing an EXP somewhat less catastrophic, I think the suggestion to make LtInt cheap garr tech, or to let every faction keep LtInts if their EXP blows, would be a better way to achieve this.

IMO, buying bombers early on plays the perfect tune of sacrificing early expansion for early hitting power. It has been proven time and time again that they can work as a makeshift gunship.

MadAccountant wrote:QUOTE (MadAccountant @ Apr 25 2008, 08:35 PM) My biggest problem with the opening is that lt ints can easily catch up to a con whereas figs are screwed (except rix of course). Figs can't even get out of their home sector fast without using more than one "bucket" of fuel. So you can either

have your figs launch ready and go with the con.

people need to learn that they don't need to boost everywhere. in most travelling with a fig you should just be flying normally. anticipating where you need to be instead of boosting to get there is a better way to do it.

but i guess figs are easier to buff than players...

... why am i arguing against improving figs?