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nan2 research moved into garrison - possibly only available after a tech base has been planted.
Adv scout available for research once a tech base is up.
Hvy scout available for research when a tech base is upgraded, or when upgrading to starbase.
upgrading to starbase without a tech base would still make all of the above available, but this way, upgrading a tech base would have the same effect.
hvy bombers and gunships would still remain starbase tech.

Just have Adv scout and nan2 available in the garrison once you upgrade a tech base or the garrison.




Discuss.

Hvy scout should be starbase only. I do agree with the other two, though.

I agree with Andon. Heavy scouts should require starbase. The other two changes seem like they might be interesting.

Weylin wrote:QUOTE (Weylin @ Aug 5 2010, 08:56 PM) Scouts, playing such an important role, seem highly excluded from the whole overall arms race unless you're Bios, Giga with too much money, or you beg the commander for Rix hvy scouts.

Dont forget about the TechnoFlux Heavy scouts when fully upgraded are quite deadly as well.

Why are adv scouts in starbase in the first place? BECAUSE THEY'RE THE SINGLE MOST EFFECTIVE COUNTER TO TAC, AND YOU DON'T WANT A SINGLE PIECE OF GARRISON TECH TO RENDER AN ENTIRE TECHPATH INEFFECTIVE. Starbase at least puts an extra time&money barrier in the process of making stealths useless. On the other hand, nan2 is so damn common as floating tech that no one actually has to buy it anyway; if your team sucks so much that they couldn't pick up one single nan2 then they DESERVE to have to pay into starbase to get it.

If you take all the useful starbase tech out of starbase because you don't want to upgrade your garr, what's the point in even HAVING an upgradeable garr? If adv scouts were USEFUL, they'd be USED - the problem is that the primary advantages they bring simply don't matter until the late-game (unless your foe is tac, in which case see above), unless you're up against tac. As for hvy scouts, who needs 'em? If you want to carry two probes to a rack it's cheaper and more effective to just spend 5k on probe3, and the QL missiles and AC turret aren't really notable enough to make up the massive difference in required investment.

You're falling into the trap of "tech not used = use of that tech needs to be encouraged" when there ARE niche techs that very well should remain niche, and useless (and, IMO, essential) techs which perhaps should simply be cut out entirely.

Also, YOU'RE $#@!ING WEYLIN. That alone is good enough reason to ignore any and all suggestions and ideas you may bring to the table.

Funny some feel the same way about Jimen:)

I think what Andon proposes is more reasonable, as heavy scouts are pretty cheesy.

Also, I think Jimen is a little confused, he must think this was posted in rants.

If my name alone is really such a deterrent to people listening to anything I say, I'll consider making a new account.

weylin again amazes us with his ability to pull ideas out of his ass and spew them without thinking any of them through

Well, brood, you have to admit that in comparison to many of the other suggestions, it's not THAT bad.

this was suggested and discussed at length back when apoc was on the cc team