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I always though that moving carriers to garrison was a dumb move, but I liked it when Noir gave them a SR ability since it's pretty good for sup(sup needed help). The problem is that after the move, they can't dock anywhere untill you get a SY.

One of the main reason I rarely buy enh carriers is that I can't upgrade the carriers I already built. The enh carrier upgrade is only usefull if you buy extra carriers, which makes it pretty expensive. I'd often like to build 2 carriers, buy the enh upgrade and then upgrade my carriers but I can't. I also feel that holding carriers untill you get the enh upgrade is usually counter-productive.



So what I'd suggest is to move back carriers to SY and replace the Garrison version by a SR drone which would be like a carrier that can't let ships dock. This drone could dock at the garrison or any other base and be upgraded. You could improve the SR ability if you consider this as a nerf.



It'd make enh carriers(or drones) much more attractice, at least to me.

I only like to get carrier upgrade as giga because they are ridiculously easy to spam.



At the very least, I think that Enh carriers should either get a standard research price(5k) or an energy regen perk. My point is that $7500 is very expansive when you consider that you'll need to buy new carriers to use it. 1 enh carrier will cost you 12500. As for what you get:
- 66% extra hull is nice, but what you need with carrier is to be able to rip more ships, not living longer(unless you're using it as a bombing tool)
-20% extra energy isn't a real "20%" more effective upgrade. When you consider carriers on a larger timeframe, what lets you rip more ships to a carrier isn't its total energy but it's energy regeneration.

Vlymoxyd wrote:QUOTE (Vlymoxyd @ Jul 9 2009, 10:34 PM) -20% extra energy isn't a real "20%" more effective upgrade. When you consider carriers on a larger timeframe, what lets you rip more ships to a carrier isn't its total energy but it's energy regeneration.

Excellent point. Faster energy regen would be better... or both.

On paper, carriers seem pretty weak, especially when compared to something like a rix ripscout (iirc, hvy ripscouts are essentially tiny attack carriers).

In practice: Carriers are extremely effective if used properly and really don't need to be any stronger than they already are.

He's not saying that they should be, he simply wants enh carriers to be worth the money you pay for them.

I'd like to see the 20% energy perk changed to a 20% energy regen perk. I'd also like to see carrier drones be able to dock at regular bases, but I'm not sure that's possible so changing them to a SR drone a la GT is probably the best route.

Yeah, the problem isn't carriers but the enh carrier upgrade. It is 50% more expensive than a standard upgrade, is somewhat weak and you won't be able to upgrade the carriers that are already out without a SY.

My main suggestion(drones that can dock) wouldn't make enh carriers better, it'd actually be a nerf to the carrier itself( It wouldn't be able to reload ships anymore). This change, however, would allow all carriers to be upgraded and not just the new ones. That would make it a much better upgrade for a team that already has carriers out.


I got another idea but it deserve its own thread.

I think that carriers are fine as is. Maybe bump the enh carrier research down. Here's the thing: yes, the reasearch is worthless, but carriers aren't broken, so don't fix them. Fix the research.

I thought carriers could dock at the garrison?
Drone carriers, not player controlled ones.

My name is Weylin, and I have just said something silly. I should spend the 30 seconds required to check my facts before posting in this forum.

Sincerely sorry,
-Weylin

phoenix1 wrote:QUOTE (phoenix1 @ Jul 9 2009, 11:36 PM) I think that carriers are fine as is. Maybe bump the enh carrier research down. Here's the thing: yes, the reasearch is worthless, but carriers aren't broken, so don't fix them. Fix the research.

But the main point is that the research is useless because carriers can't actually be upgraded without a SY., so the research only applies to new carriers, adding substantially to the cost. If one accepts that the research is broken, it seems the carriers themselves have to be changed to make the research worthwhile. Apparently, either by making the carriers smaller or by giving them something bigger to dock with besides the SY.

It seems like a scary big change, but it makes sense. Research simply isn't worth as much if you can't use it to upgrade already-existing drones.

Girlyboy. Let me sum up this thread for you:

"We can't upgrade existing carriers, so we should remove them/replace them with something less useful!"

Worthless tech exists. Lt boost 2 anyone? EMP? Also, we can't upgrade heavy ints, should we remove them? If the argument is "enh carrier research is worthless so we should fix it" then fine. But fix the research because at the moment there is nothing wrong with carriers. They're a powerful and useful tech that can really win a game for you.

EDIT:

Vlymoxyd wrote:QUOTE (Vlymoxyd @ Jul 9 2009, 03:20 PM) Yeah, the problem isn't carriers but the enh carrier upgrade. It is 50% more expensive than a standard upgrade, is somewhat weak and you won't be able to upgrade the carriers that are already out without a SY.

Simple solution: don't buy the research!

Another Simple solution would be lowering the price