For a stick jockey like me one of the problems with Allegiance is that it has minimum deadzone set in 1999. Ten years on, with a nice joystick & good control software I'd really like to have the option to turn the game's dead zone to zero.
Can you lovely devs make this happen, or is it more difficult than I think?
Joystick deadzones
This has been requested before, just not done yet.Adept wrote:QUOTE (Adept @ Apr 21 2009, 06:29 PM) For a stick jockey like me one of the problems with Allegiance is that it has minimum deadzone set in 1999. Ten years on, with a nice joystick & good control software I'd really like to have the option to turn the game's dead zone to zero.
Can you lovely devs make this happen, or is it more difficult than I think?
There are currently two options, large and small dead zones which equate to 0.3 and 0.1.
It should be fairly straight forward to add a third option of 'none' that equates to 0.0
I think the earlier request was to add a few more like 0.3, 0.1, 0.05, 0.01, and 0.0
Things like autopilot are disengaged on joystick input so you may not want it set to 0.0 unless you control the joystick deadzone with the joystick driver, etc.
Unfortunately dev effort has really stalled with the 'old' devs either not having time to work on Alleg, disheartened with the community, or frustrated as they want much larger changes that get bogged down in the community. Or some combo of all three.
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Thanks Dogbones.Dogbones wrote:QUOTE (Dogbones @ May 5 2009, 11:59 PM) I think the earlier request was to add a few more like 0.3, 0.1, 0.05, 0.01, and 0.0
Things like autopilot are disengaged on joystick input so you may not want it set to 0.0 unless you control the joystick deadzone with the joystick driver, etc.
The 0.0 would be perfect for me, and others with a modern stick & software, as I could then tweak the zone to the very minimum needed with a good modern stick. The 0.1 is based on technology now 10 years out of date afterall.
<bp|> Maybe when I grow up I can be a troll like PsycH
<bp|> or an obsessive compulsive paladin of law like Adept
I think there'd need to be 2 deadzones, one for disengagement and one for flying.
I remember playing with joysticks that didn't force a large deadzone, I had problems ripping anywhere because the rip would always cancel themselves if I didn't hold the joystick very tight. I also couldn't leave the joystick to type and autopilot didn't work either.
A large deadzone is extremely annoying when some of the stuff are far away. My "a little bit to the right" is far from "A little bit to the left".
I remember playing with joysticks that didn't force a large deadzone, I had problems ripping anywhere because the rip would always cancel themselves if I didn't hold the joystick very tight. I also couldn't leave the joystick to type and autopilot didn't work either.
A large deadzone is extremely annoying when some of the stuff are far away. My "a little bit to the right" is far from "A little bit to the left".
This is what I have. It's not even expensive. There are more sensitive and precise sticks out there, but this is perfect for me with all those buttons and good software.Keshi wrote:QUOTE (Keshi @ Jul 4 2009, 08:40 PM) What joystick do you use that has pretty much 0 deadzone? Cuz I'd like one too...!
We need to have the option of the 0 deadzone for two reasons.
a) It's not 1999 anymore. Joysticks are better, and will keep getting better. We don't want to force a larger deadzone than is needed.
b) Good controller software let's you set exactly as much deadzone as you need and want. The game, again shouldn't force it on you.
As things are, us stick pilots aren't getting full use out of our gear. This should hopefully be quick and easy to fix. I live in hope that it will be included in R5.
<bp|> Maybe when I grow up I can be a troll like PsycH
<bp|> or an obsessive compulsive paladin of law like Adept
Sorry to be out of topic, but is there a "hat" on that joystick? If there's one and that it's as good as you say, I'm a buyer!
My current joystick currently goes pretty far from the center when I don't hold it, I know that a smaller deadzone would suck for me.
I think you should post it under the FAZ forums adept. It really doesn't sound like a hard change.
In the case that adding new deadzones would be hard, I beleive that just changing the current values could work(Let's say large =0.1 , normal = 0.05.
My current joystick currently goes pretty far from the center when I don't hold it, I know that a smaller deadzone would suck for me.
I think you should post it under the FAZ forums adept. It really doesn't sound like a hard change.
In the case that adding new deadzones would be hard, I beleive that just changing the current values could work(Let's say large =0.1 , normal = 0.05.
Ok i have a joystick deadzone (and inverse deadzone) toggle of none, but no joystick to test. (Small, Large, None) in that order..
const float g_fJoystickDeadZoneSmall = 0.1f;
const float g_fJoystickDeadZoneLarge = 0.3f;
const float g_fJoystickDeadZoneNone = 0.0f;
If you have a joystick and or a controller, preferably a controller (xbox style reported not functional in R5) with force feedback and can test please join me in #freeallegiance on Quakenet. The DirectInput interfaces have changed from R4 to R5 and this needs to be addressed.
MSG me in IRC and I will send you a test build so you can Confirm/Deny and provide immediate feedback - that way I can get the changes into the next beta w/o having to worry if it works or not.
EDIT: Deadzone feature is added ! this code change has been COMPLETED
const float g_fJoystickDeadZoneSmall = 0.1f;
const float g_fJoystickDeadZoneLarge = 0.3f;
const float g_fJoystickDeadZoneNone = 0.0f;
If you have a joystick and or a controller, preferably a controller (xbox style reported not functional in R5) with force feedback and can test please join me in #freeallegiance on Quakenet. The DirectInput interfaces have changed from R4 to R5 and this needs to be addressed.
MSG me in IRC and I will send you a test build so you can Confirm/Deny and provide immediate feedback - that way I can get the changes into the next beta w/o having to worry if it works or not.
EDIT: Deadzone feature is added ! this code change has been COMPLETED
Last edited by Imago on Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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joeld wrote:But we’ve been amazed at the level to which some of the Allegiance fans have remained hard-core.
I'm interested to test, but could I ask again to have different deadzone options rather than just 0.3,0.1 and none?
I've been a joystick user for 10 years. I don't want to repeat myself, but here's my personal experience:
0.3 is REALLY ugly. If your joystick suck so much that you need to use 0.3, I'd suggest learning how to use a mouse or start using a keyboard! it's nearly impossible to aim with 0.3.
0.1 sucks and is too large most of the time. My current joystick really sucks, but I still think it could handle a smaller deadzone. I beleive that adept is correct: Most joysticks today are too good for a 0.1 deadzone. My crappy 5 or 6 year old joystick is "too good" for a 0.1 deadzone.
0.0 would be too small for any joystick that isn't perfect. I used logitech joystick(cheaper versions) in the past and after 2 weeks, they weren't perfect anymore. By not perfect I mean that it doesn't stay completely straight when I don't hold it.
I beleive that something in-between 0.1 and 0.0 is needed. A 0.1 deadzone is a pretty LARGE deadzone, and I'd love to have something smaller. However, 0.0 probably wouldn't work for me.
I'd also like to say again how awfull allegiance is when you play with a smaller deadzone than what you should have.
I remember with my other joysticks, I often had to restart my ripcord 2 or 3 times because they'd get interupted because the joystick moved a little bit every time. Or when I went to the bathroom on autopilot in a 2 hour game while in a pod and found myself turning in the middle of nowhere when i came back(and avoiding any pu).
I beleive that a disengagement deadzone is needed. I also think that it would be ok to do it for mouse and keyboard too since the code is probably the same. With a larger disengagement deadzone, joystick users could play with much smaller combat deadzones.
Just to make it clear: The main problem with small deadzones is that autopilot and ripcords often cancels when you don't want to. In combat, there's like no advantage to have one.
Edit: I forgot to say thanks and good job, which was the most important point I wanted to make!
I've been a joystick user for 10 years. I don't want to repeat myself, but here's my personal experience:
0.3 is REALLY ugly. If your joystick suck so much that you need to use 0.3, I'd suggest learning how to use a mouse or start using a keyboard! it's nearly impossible to aim with 0.3.
0.1 sucks and is too large most of the time. My current joystick really sucks, but I still think it could handle a smaller deadzone. I beleive that adept is correct: Most joysticks today are too good for a 0.1 deadzone. My crappy 5 or 6 year old joystick is "too good" for a 0.1 deadzone.
0.0 would be too small for any joystick that isn't perfect. I used logitech joystick(cheaper versions) in the past and after 2 weeks, they weren't perfect anymore. By not perfect I mean that it doesn't stay completely straight when I don't hold it.
I beleive that something in-between 0.1 and 0.0 is needed. A 0.1 deadzone is a pretty LARGE deadzone, and I'd love to have something smaller. However, 0.0 probably wouldn't work for me.
I'd also like to say again how awfull allegiance is when you play with a smaller deadzone than what you should have.
I remember with my other joysticks, I often had to restart my ripcord 2 or 3 times because they'd get interupted because the joystick moved a little bit every time. Or when I went to the bathroom on autopilot in a 2 hour game while in a pod and found myself turning in the middle of nowhere when i came back(and avoiding any pu).
I beleive that a disengagement deadzone is needed. I also think that it would be ok to do it for mouse and keyboard too since the code is probably the same. With a larger disengagement deadzone, joystick users could play with much smaller combat deadzones.
Just to make it clear: The main problem with small deadzones is that autopilot and ripcords often cancels when you don't want to. In combat, there's like no advantage to have one.
Edit: I forgot to say thanks and good job, which was the most important point I wanted to make!
Last edited by Vlymoxyd on Thu Jul 09, 2009 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.