Discussion of Bios changes

theTroy · Post by **theTroy** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:38 pm

LANS wrote:QUOTE (LANS @ Jun 23 2010, 10:26 AM) What about reducing the cost of buying a new miner? That way they could still get a miner out by paydaying in reasonable time. If miners need to have lowered capacity or yield, or longer build time to balance the cheaper cost, so be it. The payday nerf will still put bios economy on similar footing to the other factions with the necessity of mining.

However, I fail to see how requiring bios to mine will make them weaker. If they run effective miner D (like other factions must do in order to win), they'll not only have enough money for their uber-endgame-tech, but at the already low tech costs will probably have the cash to go double-tech in the same time. And if you reduce miner yield so that it take Bios the same number of rocks to reach adv. tech as, say, IC for example, you just removed the perk which was designed to offset the 10-minute research time.

I don't have the answers to any of this stuff, but I haven't seen this question brought up yet.

Bios are going to have a bottleneck in 2 ways.

If they have a miner and they mine freely, they get their tech in 10 minutes. If they spend their whole team defending a miner during that time, the opposite team will mine to the same tech in less time and should theoretically be able to steamroll them by the time they finally get endgame.

If they dont have a miner and are making sure to kill the enemy miners with a whole team, bios will not be able to payday tech as fast (if paydays are reduced) allowing the opposing team to get the tech earlier and steamroll them theoretically.

Either way bios lose (theoretically). To win they are forced to keep the enemy miners dead, while making sure that they mine themselves, as any other faction.

Xeretov · Post by **Xeretov** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 7:37 pm

LANS wrote:QUOTE (LANS @ Jun 23 2010, 01:26 PM) What about reducing the cost of buying a new miner?

Because making miners cheaper makes them easier to replace? Thus devaluing the whole purpose of forcing Bios teams to care about their miners?

Post by **zombywoof** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:59 am

Xeretov wrote:QUOTE (Xeretov @ Jun 23 2010, 12:37 PM) Because making miners cheaper makes them easier to replace? Thus devaluing the whole purpose of forcing Bios teams to care about their miners?

What about Paydays to .5 and miners to 3k instead of 4k?

Xeretov · Post by **Xeretov** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:03 am

No matter what you do to Bios paydays, cashboxes are still worth $500 a pop. And no, I don't see a need to change that right now either.

Cheaper miners also pay themselves off with smaller loads. If you want an example, compare TF miners - which cost more than a full load out of one - to Belters miners, which practically pay for themselves twice over with a full load. Sure TF sucks in this regard because of the high miner cost + low capacity, but Bios is a lot closer to Belts with its 1.0 He3 attributes across the board than it is to TF.

Making their miners cheaper just doesn't seem necessary to me in regards to what we're trying to accomplish here.

theTroy · Post by **theTroy** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:27 am

What is the average rate of income from cashbox mining? I am not sure where to find data on that (frequency of them appearing, probability, how many cashboxes on average per sector per minute, etc) to see just how much impact do cashboxes compared to paydays.

spideycw · Post by **spideycw** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:33 pm

theTroy wrote:QUOTE (theTroy @ Jun 24 2010, 04:27 AM) What is the average rate of income from cashbox mining? I am not sure where to find data on that (frequency of them appearing, probability, how many cashboxes on average per sector per minute, etc) to see just how much impact do cashboxes compared to paydays.

Well just to give a practical application. C101 once picked up 100k for me in cash boxes over the spam of maybe 90-120 minutes

RealPandemonium · Post by **RealPandemonium** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:47 pm

It can't be 50k/hour lol. Were treasures on High? It's also worth noting that the opposing team can pick up the cashboxes that would otherwise have gone to the bios team.

FazzBumm · Post by **FazzBumm** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:44 pm

Just a spontaneous Idea:
Reduce Payday to 0.5, Reduce Miner Cost to 2k, Higher miner building time to 4-5 minutes

I think that would fit into the BIOS concept of slow but cheap and good ....

Koln · Post by **Koln** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:48 pm

FazzBumm wrote:QUOTE (FazzBumm @ Jun 24 2010, 05:44 PM) Just a spontaneous Idea:
Reduce Payday to 0.5, Reduce Miner Cost to 2k, Higher miner building time to 4-5 minutes

I think that would fit into the BIOS concept of slow but cheap and good ....

4-5 minutes until 2nd miner makes for a really late tech base or little to no partialling in the Garrison.

Looks good to me.

spideycw · Post by **spideycw** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:54 pm

RealPandemonium wrote:QUOTE (RealPandemonium @ Jun 24 2010, 10:47 AM) It can't be 50k/hour lol. Were treasures on High? It's also worth noting that the opposing team can pick up the cashboxes that would otherwise have gone to the bios team.

Why not? Between the occasional floating aleph res and rotating through a 14 sector map or so doing nothing but picking up cashboxes one would think you could definitely find 100 in an hour.