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Beyond everything I already have lined up for fixing, I'm not sure if there are any major issues that specifically cause problems in the level of play seen in pugs vs. the higher level of organization and teamwork in squadgames. Things that are most guilty of an offense like that are those that require overcomplex twelve-step strategies over the course of an hour in order to win with, which obviously don't work well in a pug setting and are passable in squadgames. Even with all the modifications in XC, everything is pretty distinct, straightforward, and doesn't play very differently, if at all, from how it always has.

Adept wrote:QUOTE (Adept @ Apr 9 2011, 05:26 PM) First of all, Virulence said he wanted a core balanced for more competetive SG play. It's a bit hard to see how this will happen when there are wild changes going away from core aspects of gameplay that have held their form for a decade. If anything it will mean lower quality gameplay. In a more traditional core people who mostly / only play squad games get full benefit from their years of experience. In XC only people who actively follow the lates changes will know the new balance points. The biggest advantage is for Virulence as a commander, and it's unlikely to give him a more serious challenge in squad games, as I think he wanted. A really good commander with hundreads of games commanded will be pretty damn surprised when he tries to use SY in a squad game played on XC4.

Doesn't this basically boil down to "all change is bad, alternative cores are bad"? If so, why even bother updating CC? Why not just go back to MS 1.25 or DN_whatever? I find it particularly funny that you singled out the SY changes as a cause of consternation, considering that the CC team made significant changes to SY only a few releases ago. That goes for most of the other issues you raise; even CC makes enough changes with each new release that anyone who didn't read the changelogs is gonna be in trouble.

On the other issue you raise: what kind of $#@!ing idiot of a commander doesn't check out a new core before he comms it? Are you really suggesting that there's going to be an epidemic of people not bothering to learn a major core they're about to comm a SG on? If so, that qualifies as base stupidity and they completely deserve the solid rear-hatch pounding they're about to get. Some of us like to bring our A-game to squad games.

Bad players are bad no matter the core they play on, or command on.

Do whatever you want to CC, RT, and XT will still beat you on it.
Or we can play on XC, and XT will beat you on it.
Or we can play on EoR, and XT will beat you on it.

With the same "logic" Adept has put forth, RT should have won every game on EoR simply due to fact that they knew the core/how to "command" on it.
That of course was anything but what happened. Not to the mention the fact that RT, despite the fact that they played on EoR more than anyone else, managed to overlook the obvious bugs on the core, denied their existence, and lied about them after the fact.
We've seen you try to "balance" a core before. Quit wasting our time.

and you come up with this @#(! about how "the people with years of experience will benefit from playing on CC because it's a traditional core"
THE PEOPLE WITH YEARS OF EXPERIENCE WOULD RATHER PLAY ON XC, WHO THE $#@! ARE YOU

Having talked with Virulence a few times last sunday, I'd like to set a few things straight. I thought about starting a new thread, but I think I'll just post it here.

I'll start with this. I didn't want to make drama or start any fights. I apologise for letting this thing get to me as it did. That was silly, and didn't help matters in any way. I already apologised for it to Virulence in person, but the same goes for all of my part in this drama. I care deeply for Allegiance, and I think I let myself get too worked up because of it. I'll try to do better in the future.

I'm just one guy, this is my personal take on things, and not some official position of the CC team.

***

Anyway. The nature of the community core makes it slow to change, and I think for what it's for that is to an extent a good thing. It will most likely remain "classic Allegiance", with a familiar role between the tech paths, and emphasis on balance tweaks and polish, rather than radical changes.

That said, there is a lot to be said for what Virulence is doing. He's been able to take ideas that have been resisted forever, and put them in in quick succession. Rix heavy scouts with dual gatlings instead of the annoying mini-AC are a great example (the dual nans being a nice touch). Many, many things that were discussed, but which are slow to implement when people aren't willing to face change. This way things like removing PPs entirely finally got tried out, rather than endlessly argued about.

So yeah, after getting a deep breath and calming down I have to say there's nothing wrong with a fast moving and boldly experimental core like this. It's good to have options.

Peace

I'll drink to that Adept. Happy to hear you've calmed

Dorjan wrote:QUOTE (Dorjan @ Apr 10 2011, 04:38 AM) But when all the "vets" rejected taking over CC when Spidey stepped down and Adept and Das took over that was at least someone.

I'd love to hear more about this myself, cuz I'm not quite sure what you are on about

this interests me as well, considering i was there and all. i guess i missed something!

Damn, and here I was about to kidnap Adept's family in the name of GREAT JUSTICE.

Ahhhh well.

Spidey, when you left didn't you suggest who should have it? Normally stepping down ZLs do that. Not only that, isn't their a vote to promote?

I can't believe that Das was just thrown it as first pick without anyone else having the chance to take over, that would just be stupid. If it is the case I'm lulwtfing and think that CC must really be a trololololol

Dorjan wrote:QUOTE (Dorjan @ Apr 15 2011, 01:03 PM) Spidey, when you left didn't you suggest who should have it? Normally stepping down ZLs do that. Not only that, isn't their a vote to promote?

I can't believe that Das was just thrown it as first pick without anyone else having the chance to take over, that would just be stupid. If it is the case I'm lulwtfing and think that CC must really be a trololololol

He did, Das was his third suggestion, after Xere and myself.