Horrible story about the NYPD

[Bacon_00]

QUOTE (NightRychune @ Feb 14 2012, 08:15 AM) bacon when we can turn people into ducks transduckism will become a thing, i promise

No doubt.

[Sundance_]

QUOTE (girlyboy @ Feb 14 2012, 09:11 AM) ... That's worrisome... I'd worry about the safety of a transgendered woman getting housed with men. Especially since, as I understand it, we're talking about long-term jailing, not a day or two for processing for minor offences like in the story.

I'm assuming this is out of your hands, and you're just following the established rules, but I think those rules are wrong. If someone identifies as a woman, and they have to spend who-knows-how-long in jail with men, and being treated like a man, that's pretty depressing. Whether they're a convicted criminal or not, that's just a basic case of unjust treatment. Also, while presumably people like you are keeping an eye on the situation to prevent abuse... You probably can't prevent every single case of verbal and physical abuse 24/7 in an environment like that, and you're still housing a woman in a jail with men. And a woman who is probably especially vulnerable to abuse, and especially likely to become a target for abuse, given how common transphobia is. You're saying the alternative would cause "too many problems," but the current situation you describe seems like one big giant problem to me already.

Also, regardless of what is "still under the hood" as you put it, a trans-woman (i.e. a woman who has a Y chromosome and was born with a physically male body) is still a woman, not "a man, identifying as a woman"; and there's no need to put "she" in scare quotes, etc. <Shrug> I don't want to come across as a jerk towards you, as I'm sure you are a "good cop" who genuinely cares about issues like the abuse and mistreatment of prisoners (at first I wanted to write another rant in this post... >_< Probably would not have been very helpful). And given that, I'm happy at least there are people like you in the system where you work, as opposed to the abusive sort of people in the original news story. But this is more a case of the whole system being depressingly wrong (while in the original news story, conversely, the cops were @#$%@#s in a place where the law actually was clearly on the side of the transgendered person). One can only hope someday in the not-too-distant future it will change through legislative or judicial action. ... Though if it's an area where culture as a whole tends to be socially conservative, that seems kind of unlikely, sadly.

We've actually never had to house a trans-woman for long term. I think she was in our jail for 2 days, and we let her have a single-person cell for that period, mainly by her own choice. I really don't know what we would do if we had to house her long term. Housing her with other females was not an option, because she still had male genitalia. I don't think many jails in the state would be comfortable housing this woman with other females. It really, REALLY is a safety issue.

You are correct when you say it causes many, many problems.

And I didn't use single quotes for you this time!

[Adept]

QUOTE (NightRychune @ Feb 14 2012, 05:19 PM) ...women are just as likely to ostracize and abuse a transgendered male identifying as female than men are, or vice versa

especially as we are talking about prisoners here.

[BackTrak]

QUOTE (Bacon @ Feb 14 2012, 09:54 AM) If a person claims he's a lizard, do we then set up legislature to protect his lizard status?

Apparently, Lookism is somewhat illegal in Michigan. So yeh, we can legislate that. Who knew?

[Bard]

QUOTE (Bacon @ Feb 14 2012, 09:54 AM) I'm sorry, if you have a penis, you're a man. If you have a vagina, you are a woman. If you claim otherwise, you have a mental disorder.

Actually there's been some research into how the brain works and more specifically on the brain and gender and it turns out that scientifically, you're most likely incorrect.


The science is still new but I'd wager there's something to this and that SOME transgender people happened to get a set of sex organs that didn't match their in utero brain development.

[DonKarnage]

If it's really an issue, can't these people be tested by a psychologist to best determine what prison they should be brought to?
Either way they're gonna get targeted, it's human nature to do so. The only thing I can think of is solitary confinement, or transfer to a jail that has an isolated section for the outcasts that would probably get killed if they were with the others.

[Vortrog]

Hmmm...how about "don't break the law?"

[MrChaos]

Story Time With MrChaos

I was in FL with my ex and meBoy back when he was around six or so. It was a vacation for us all, and we were being a bit goofy happpy to be in the warm sushine and enjoying the vacation. Two gents came in to the resturant we were at. One of them was wearing a skirt. Neither was acting effeminate, very butch in fact. So I point out the fellow to the ex, we both tee hee a bit, quietly and not overtly but it was obvious we were amused about something. So meBoy asks what we are laughing about, and I said look over at the other table at what the man is wearing. He responds with, " Oh I saw the skirt, but I didn't think that was funny. People should be allowed to be whoever they want to as long as it isn't mean to others."

Welp I was embarassed and proud. The first for being told what a child I was being by my own child. The second should be obvious.

A transgender man becoming preggers is definitely odd but why isn't it ok?

[Sundance_]

QUOTE (Vortrog @ Feb 14 2012, 06:20 PM) Hmmm...how about "don't break the law?"

I like you?

[DonKarnage]

So what's worse, quietly being amused of a man wearing a dress, or making someone feel like a total immature piece of @#(! for showing amusement of such a thing?