We should not let...

[Koln]

QUOTE (BackTrak @ Jul 20 2010, 10:31 PM) Perhaps adding more ranks, and making it easier to rank up ala WoW would also provide a draw. People do like to show off, and they like to feel they are improving. Giving them a way to show progress and some bragging rights is a great motivator to keep them coming back to play, instead of having them stuck at rank 8 for 3 or 4 months.

Do you really see someone who likes to "brag" about him going up from rank 6 to rank 8 going anywhere in this community? All i would expect was some kind of the @#$%@#s we have around to pick on him and bash him. And then he'll leave and never come back. There are three ways to stay in this community: keeping a low profile, being inmune to bashing or being really good at it. That reduces drastically the number of potential players that would stay playing around, so even if we had a thousand ranks and give ranks out by time playing i don't think it would solve anything. I'd rather think of something like this:

QUOTE (KGJV @ Jul 20 2010, 11:11 PM) So fix the community before trying to fix the game may be ?

+1.

Also:

QUOTE (Xeretov @ Jul 20 2010, 11:41 PM) I think some newbies need a firm weeding out though. Namely the loudmouthed VC spammers who call us retarded for trying to explain ranks or nanning to them. They are incredibly frustrating to deal with.

We all agree with you with that, and i think that Adept wasn't thinking about those when posting. While some people are the paradigm of patience and can stand spammers and wanna-be whores with the 0 tag, that kind of newbies are an exception to that "rule" IMO.

[Spinoza]

QUOTE (Spinoza @ Jul 20 2010, 07:57 PM) We need more information on why people try Allegiance and why they leave.

I repeat: we need to know why people join and why they leave before we start floating ideas.

Explanation:
We need to why people join, meaning what do they expect. If a lot of people join expecting something that Alleg is not, that's one type of problem.
We need to know why people leave and when. This may indicate other types of problems.
Do they leave because the graphics suck?
Do they leave because they lag?
Do they leave because there are not enough games running to whet their appetite?
Do they leave because of asshats?
Do they leave because kids today like to try things and abandon them quickly?

Does anyone beside me and Iron_wolf care about having any information before making suggestions?

[cashto]

QUOTE (Spinoza @ Jul 20 2010, 03:08 PM) I repeat: we need to know why people join and why they leave before we start floating ideas.

How do you suppose we gather this data?

"Hi, we see you played for a week and then disappeared for the next three months. Mind telling us why?"

[Vortrog]

QUOTE (Xeretov @ Jul 21 2010, 07:02 AM) I have a no-fly list for a reason: Flying for those comms (or with certain people) just isn't fun. I'm quite happy to put up with a comm who is still learning (and willing to learn) but many of the comms on my no-fly list don't seem willing to listen or improve.

I dont think we have the player base or stand up comm(edian)s to afford this luxury anymore, and that sux.

Excuse my ignorance on this next suggestion if AFS is already doing this...

I personally would like to see the Newbie server populated by two volunteer comms from AFS or Alleg's at all times running conquest games where circle flying is permitted and all other voobs and vets are banned, unless they are AFS. The games would probably be sucky 2v2s but it is a much more easy introduction to allegiance than being ordered into a Galv run (or insert other tactical role) on the main when you have no idea what a galv is.

The server would have to allow AFS/Alleg tags plus noobs only (no autobans for the AFS/Alleg). The comms must stay in base at all times, with the exception of scouting and using a nan.
Yes this would be a false environment, but it gives them the taste for solo galving/bombing or HTTing a base. That would give them enough of a taste for more destruction to keep hanging around.
More importantly, I would be directing noobs from the main to go to this side game. This will prevent them from getting whored before they get a taste for the game and might lead to higher retention. We gotta try.

And yes, it will deplete the main of numbers, but at least it might make the main stronger in the long term.

[Elzam_]

+1 to Vort. If you train newbies to stay, and keep training them. They staying guys will stay, the new guys will stay and you always have a few new guys running into the main making games larger.

[WhiskeyGhost]

of the people i've personally asked, the responses were as follows:

I stopped playing because it was too hard to be useful.
Man, I stopped because it was too complicated.
Didn't wanna play anymore, not with those @#$%@#s.

and

If I wanted to sit around in a chat room for an hour, i'd just cut out the game altogether. I understand the concept of balancing the teams out and everything, but it looks to me like there is more people interested in an easy win then a somewhat balanced and/or competitive game.


After that, i stopped trying to recruit people i know into Alleg.

[fwiffo]

while we sit and post on forum during what is typically prime time for alleg, how about actually playing the game... heck i wish i could but im not at home yet. and for all the complainers, how many of you actually took a newbie or two under your wing and tried to show him the ropes. sure, there is a problem but are you part of the solution or are you just here to vent your frustration?

rather than talk about the negative aspects of the problem, why dont we talk about what little bit each of us is doing everyday in an attempt to better the community? who knows, maybe by some miraculous chance, we might even learn something from each other and focus on whats working.

[spideycw]

Very little commentary on the fact that so many people are so horrible now that we lose tons of old players.

I even saw aarmstrong command a pickup game a month ago and state "he remembered why he stopped playing pug's" after the quality of his team was so abysmal. And no his team was not newbies they were people who should have been half decent.

Not sure about you all but I for one am curious why so many vets end up leaving.

[Gandalf2]

QUOTE (Vortrog @ Jul 20 2010, 11:14 PM) I personally would like to see the Newbie server populated by two volunteer comms from AFS or Alleg's at all times running conquest games where circle flying is permitted and all other voobs and vets are banned, unless they are AFS. The games would probably be sucky 2v2s but it is a much more easy introduction to allegiance than being ordered into a Galv run (or insert other tactical role) on the main when you have no idea what a galv is.

The server would have to allow AFS/Alleg tags plus noobs only (no autobans for the AFS/Alleg). The comms must stay in base at all times, with the exception of scouting and using a nan.
Yes this would be a false environment, but it gives them the taste for solo galving/bombing or HTTing a base. That would give them enough of a taste for more destruction to keep hanging around.
More importantly, I would be directing noobs from the main to go to this side game. This will prevent them from getting whored before they get a taste for the game and might lead to higher retention. We gotta try.

Having volunteers on there at all times is a heck of a commitment... what we do have now though is the @Help tag, who are allowed on the newbie server. There have been many occasions of there being a fair few newbies around, so a couple of @Help or @Alleg ppl grab the newbies, go over to the newbie server and show them the ropes - a good time is had by all You can't ask people to always do that, though. I'd go mad it my alleg experience was 80% helping newbies on the newbie server, though 25-30% I could do.

QUOTE (spideycw @ Jul 20 2010, 11:26 PM) Very little commentary on the fact that so many people are so horrible now that we lose tons of old players.

I even saw aarmstrong command a pickup game a month ago and state "he remembered why he stopped playing pug's" after the quality of his team was so abysmal. And no his team was not newbies they were people who should have been half decent.

Not sure about you all but I for one am curious why so many vets end up leaving.

Good questions indeed. The amount of pilots who "only play SG's cos pugs suck" is fairly staggering; I can really only see their attitude as selfish (or, they are VERY busy people). We need vets just as much as we need newbies - and as earlier stated, some people need to leave their egos at the door. "Everyone sucks nowerdays" is a complete misnomer - it's the player moaning about it who has gotten better.

[l1ngus]

I don't see one proposal in this thread even worth considering.