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Archangelus · Post by **Archangelus** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:28 am

fishbone wrote:QUOTE (fishbone @ Oct 5 2011, 09:13 PM) Capitalism made America a superpower. ALL and I repeat ALL forms of socialism fail. Many critcs of Capitalism are those who feel "entitled" to what is not theirs. Again, "If I'm poor it's because a rich person made me this way by taking advantage of me." What a crock! Sharp...did ya ever stop to think you are poor because you are lazy, unmotivated, and lack skills required to make you successful? Quit blaming others and take control of your life. THAT is Capitalism....opportunity for those who want to succeed. Unfortunately, the dregs stay poor in such a system and they can't stand it.

Unfortunately, capitalism isnt really like that. Try beeing better than Bill Gate's soon. I bet that it won't matter how skilled you are, he would still succeed, and you will fail.

raumvogel · Post by **raumvogel** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 2:27 am

Being fishbone is from Huntsville, I'm sure he didn't inherit money from his rocket scientist dad or anything.

/ Fishbone Von Braun?

ryujin · Post by **ryujin** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:07 am

fishbone wrote:QUOTE (fishbone @ Oct 5 2011, 08:13 PM) Capitalism made America a superpower. ALL and I repeat ALL forms of socialism fail. Many critcs of Capitalism are those who feel "entitled" to what is not theirs. Again, "If I'm poor it's because a rich person made me this way by taking advantage of me." What a crock! Sharp...did ya ever stop to think you are poor because you are lazy, unmotivated, and lack skills required to make you successful? Quit blaming others and take control of your life. THAT is Capitalism....opportunity for those who want to succeed. Unfortunately, the dregs stay poor in such a system and they can't stand it.

If we lived in a REAL capitalistic society, wouldn't the banks and the auto industry have gone under? Bailing them out is kinda socialist...

NightRychune · Post by **NightRychune** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:39 am

Yeah freeb, ideally that's how it should work and when it's kept within those limits that system works great, but thanks to our fantastic capitalist government, it seems like it can be abused and exploited at will!

Camaro · Post by **Camaro** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:57 am

Ryujin wrote:QUOTE (Ryujin @ Oct 5 2011, 06:07 PM) If we lived in a REAL capitalistic society, wouldn't the banks and the auto industry have gone under? Bailing them out is kinda socialist...

If we lived in a REAL capitalistic society there wouldn't be many banks because they would be far too unreliable... hence why they were basically banned in the 19th century by many states.

The auto industry would have gone under and been bought out by other automakers... perhaps... without a banking industry it is pretty hard for there to be any huge bubbles because financing things would be much more difficult. The economy would, theoretically, be more stable and prices of durable goods much cheaper... which leads us to wonder if the auto industry would be in any problems at all.

It would also have made foreign imported goods less favorable because the competition in costs would be much greater.

Of course there are also a lot of negatives associated with a REAL capitalistic society.

Makida · Post by **Makida** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:38 pm

If you really wanted to succeed you could be a serf in a medieval absolute monarchy and find some way to get rich and powerful, I'm sure.

T'was a fair system!

SharpFish · Post by **SharpFish** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:20 pm

fishbone wrote:QUOTE (fishbone @ Oct 5 2011, 04:13 PM) Capitalism made America a superpower. ALL and I repeat ALL forms of socialism fail.

Lol. Strictly speaking thats not true, but lets not get into that. the argument is still spurious. It took a whole bunch of failed revolts before representative republics could finally displace the old monarchies, but once it was done there was no going back.

Nor is this any answer to the problem posed. The FACT is that capitalism is a system of theft. Now you can get away with it for a while, but sooner or later the chickens come home the roost. If YOU want to preserve capitalism, then it is up to YOU to find a way for capitalism to be preserved. But you can't. As your own comments indicate, the only plan you;ve got is to abase yourself even further before the rich.

QUOTE Many critcs of Capitalism are those who feel "entitled" to what is not theirs. Again, "If I'm poor it's because a rich person made me this way by taking advantage of me." What a crock![/quote]

And that,I'm afraid, is the case. WE, the workers, create all the wealth, but we don't get to own it. Yes, weARE entitled to it, because if it wasn't for our labour none of it would exist.

QUOTE Sharp...did ya ever stop to think you are poor because you are lazy, unmotivated, and lack skills required to make you successful?[/quote]

The poorest people work the hardest and longest, and the richest work the least. Why should they, after all? TYhey hire people to do that for them. Capitalists are nothing but parasites.

QUOTE Quit blaming others and take control of your life. THAT is Capitalism....opportunity for those who want to succeed. Unfortunately, the dregs stay poor in such a system and they can't stand it.[/quote]

That's a nice romantic argument. Unfortunately it is utter bull@#(! from beginning to end. Capitalism doesn;t work. you say it made the US a superpower, but its a superpower with 40 million people on food stamps. Apparently this "superpower" is less efficient than a tribe of hunter/gatherers! You can't afford healthcare! You can't afford to look after you elderly! That;ls the state of your "superpower", because the vast majority of wealth created by all its working people is siphoned off by a parasitic elite.

As above, if you want to keep it, you fix it. You find a way to pay your citizens decent salaries, to keep them able to afford food and healthcare and housing and heat in the winters.

SharpFish · Post by **SharpFish** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:38 pm

beeman · Post by **beeman** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:13 pm

Ryujin wrote:QUOTE (Ryujin @ Oct 5 2011, 10:07 PM) If we lived in a REAL capitalistic society, wouldn't the banks and the auto industry have gone under? Bailing them out is kinda socialist...

Agreed. I was against the bailouts....you make a great point.

Sundance_ · Post by **Sundance_** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:57 pm

SharpFish wrote:QUOTE (SharpFish @ Oct 6 2011, 10:20 AM) The poorest people work the hardest and longest, and the richest work the least. Why should they, after all? TYhey hire people to do that for them. Capitalists are nothing but parasites.

That's a nice romantic argument. Unfortunately it is utter bull@#(! from beginning to end. Capitalism doesn;t work. you say it made the US a superpower, but its a superpower with 40 million people on food stamps. Apparently this "superpower" is less efficient than a tribe of hunter/gatherers! You can't afford healthcare! You can't afford to look after you elderly! That;ls the state of your "superpower", because the vast majority of wealth created by all its working people is siphoned off by a parasitic elite.

As above, if you want to keep it, you fix it. You find a way to pay your citizens decent salaries, to keep them able to afford food and healthcare and housing and heat in the winters.

Naw, the poorest people are on foodstamps but have no motivation to work and find a job. Why would you, when your unemployment + foodstamp wage is more than what you would make at 30 hours a week of $12.50/hr work?

America is fast becoming a country of entitlements, where you only have to be alive to have the government hold your hand through life.
Especially with the college dropouts learning that if you scream hard enough, people will try to give you all your need... just like in Europe.

Stagnant, anyone?