The EXP problem

Adept · Post by **Adept** » Wed May 14, 2008 3:29 pm

mcwarren4 wrote:QUOTE (mcwarren4 @ May 14 2008, 03:39 PM) <snip>
I fear that continuing to make all paths more powerful would take much of the strategy out of the game. Sort of like how XRM missles were added to sup. Its extremely rare now to see a skillful and timely tp2 drop for SRM AB. XRM tech has wiped the skill factor out of what was once an endgame strategy that required skill to execute. I understand why XRM was implemented, but its just an example as to why continually making all tech paths more powerful to balance things can be a dangerous direction to go in. You wind up with a 'win button tech' in every tech path and ships that can all kill each other within 2 seconds. I guess everyone might have more fun when it takes less skill to do things but at what point does Allegiance become something more like an arcade game rather than a strategy/FPS combo?

Mcwarren speaks wisdom. I don't think the ppl who rail against any nerf to interceptors really think it wouldn't help balance the game and make skill more important. It just seems that a part of the player base only enjoys space domination in an interceptor, and is disinterested in having to fly other stuff on occasion.

Ints should be an excellent ansver to in sector defense, but no good at hunting miners or swarming in to dominate an enemy sector.

spideycw · Post by **spideycw** » Wed May 14, 2008 5:52 pm

Picobozo wrote:QUOTE (Picobozo @ May 14 2008, 09:14 AM) I don't think that would be the case. Your thinking one v one where both people see each other and are arena fighting. The int is stealthy (unless it's decided to up their sig), it can slip in behind a fig and whack it before the fig can even turn around.

I suppose if you are in the ints territory this is true BUT what if he's in your space? Then you have no trouble seeing him and killing him fairly quickly in a SF or Fighter or a freakin scout before he can even run away because he now has light hull

WhiskeyGhost · Post by **WhiskeyGhost** » Wed May 14, 2008 6:27 pm

mcwarren4 wrote:QUOTE (mcwarren4 @ May 14 2008, 07:39 AM) Its extremely rare now to see a skillful and timely tp2 drop for SRM AB.

And yet, SRM AB is almost virtually useless against an Exp team, unless the base is right on the aleph, or the team over-extends itself. I've seen ints boost off to tp2 drops, and either kill the probe, or begin shredding the arriving bombers, and even seen XRM drops get torn to bits. Just imagine how much harder that'd be if they only had SRM AB to work with?

mcwarren4 · Post by **mcwarren4** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:05 pm

Whiskey, you missed my point. Years ago, before XRM technology, tp2 drops worked quite well. Something in the equation has changed to make XRM a necessity to do tp2 drops. Get it now?

As a side note, if you drop tp2 and you have xrm 2 and plenty of bombers, nothing will stop that run. Nothing. An XRM drop only fails either because the dropper is a moron or the defense happened to get lucky and have an int in the vicinity of the drop. Either way, if it is well executed its automatic success.

madpeople · Post by **madpeople** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:18 pm

i've seen well executed (more than 10 bbrs rip in) XRM tp2 drops stopped, it was a fairly close drop to an exp, we just got enough ints out as soon as we saw the probe, being IC adv exp with all station GAs probably saved it, the station took quite a beating.

spideycw · Post by **spideycw** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:19 pm

WhiskeyGhost wrote:QUOTE (WhiskeyGhost @ May 14 2008, 02:27 PM) And yet, SRM AB is almost virtually useless against an Exp team, unless the base is right on the aleph, or the team over-extends itself. I've seen ints boost off to tp2 drops, and either kill the probe, or begin shredding the arriving bombers, and even seen XRM drops get torn to bits. Just imagine how much harder that'd be if they only had SRM AB to work with?

Good point. We never had successful tp 2 drops years ago against Exp without XRM /rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":roll:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />

Granted people understood things like decoy drops and ripping in 2 or 3 Hvy Bombers with 10NANS and AC 3 and MED 3 not just $#@!ing Hvy bombers with XRM 1 (lawl we r ubah) but hey SRM AB is virtually worthless against an EXP team

Picobozo · Post by **Picobozo** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:39 pm

spideycw wrote:QUOTE (spideycw @ May 14 2008, 01:52 PM) I suppose if you are in the ints territory this is true BUT what if he's in your space? Then you have no trouble seeing him and killing him fairly quickly in a SF or Fighter or a freakin scout before he can even run away because he now has light hull

The only time the fighter is going to get a jump on the interceptor is if the int is trying to approach a base to camp. Again, an int is very stealthy and can boost off in a random direction and hide out of the range of missiles. Here you see one of the positive sides of this "nerf" - The int can't just barrel ass towards a fighter while shooting off chaff and not be punished. He has to either approach stealthfully, or escape and re-approach stealthfully.

Assuming that ints can still carry pulse probes I really don't see many instances where the SF is going to out gun the int. Remember the increased effectiveness of CM's in DN. CM3 + pulse probes still equals lights out for the SF in most instances IF the primary objective is a 1 v 1.

However, I do concede that Ints will have increased levels of vulnerability in most instances. I think thats the goal here. Interceptors will be more limited to actually "intercepting" in their own sectors and will have to bring friends (scouts or other ints) to survive out of their sectors. Limiting the individual effectiveness of the Interceptor is a good thing.

Also, i'm not sure how it actually is in ICE, but if they get their Light Hull I believe they have increased acceleration and agility correct? I think this is a win/win. Balance and an increase in fun level.

spideycw · Post by **spideycw** » Wed May 14, 2008 9:59 pm

With light class hull how will they survive long enough to kill UTIL craft though?

Post by **TheBored** » Wed May 14, 2008 10:05 pm

How about one of the ICE gurus lay down the differences for us? If no one does, I might try myself. I'm kinda interested in what the differences would be.

TB

Lykourgos · Post by **Lykourgos** » Wed May 14, 2008 10:12 pm

Light hull basically has no modifiers vs any weapons (except DM 19 which is some obscure AB weapon). Everything does standard damage to it.

Medium hull takes half damage from:

Utl 1-3

3/4 damage from:

Gatt 1-3
Mini 1-3
Pulse Laser
Lancer 1-3, Striker

85% damage from:
Skycap
Longtom

160% damage from:

Dis 1-3 and MiniDis

150% damage from:

Galv

I used TEK btw because I like it better than ICE. /smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />