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phungus420
- Posts: 78
- Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:24 am
How does it feel to see ideas from the other side adept? 
Zero scan range is a concept for a different core. As has been stated CC is not really here to make vast sweeping balance changes, we're more than happy to allow other cores to develop and flesh out ideas before importing them.
Zero scan range is a concept for a different core. As has been stated CC is not really here to make vast sweeping balance changes, we're more than happy to allow other cores to develop and flesh out ideas before importing them.
Get over yourselves, don't try to win arguments on the internet where the option of a punch in the mouth is unavailable
"It is not that I cannot create anything good, but that I will not." And to prove this, he created the peacock.
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phungus420
- Posts: 78
- Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:24 am
I don't think it's a sweeping change. I think ints should get their original fuel back, I want ints to be the best dogfighter in the sky... but at a cost. That seems the most balanced way to do things to me, and would require less changes then any other option given. Leave ints as they are, but make them intercepters, they intercept, they aren't long range figs unless they have a scout/con/base providing them telemetry.DasSmiter wrote:QUOTE (DasSmiter @ Mar 25 2012, 07:26 PM) How does it feel to see ideas from the other side adept?
Zero scan range is a concept for a different core. As has been stated CC is not really here to make vast sweeping balance changes, we're more than happy to allow other cores to develop and flesh out ideas before importing them.
I think 0 scan range would be too problematic. like if your scout or w/e isn't quite close enough or turns away you are going to have enemies appearing and disappearing around you like they're stealth craft. (and while I agree with interceptors having no sensors in a conceptual sense, I think it would make them exceptionally irritating to use, and no longer fun whatsoever) The scan range could be nerfed a bit perhaps, if we're trying to bring interceptors more to what they should be - the flat-out superior dogfighting craft, with absolutely not other capabilities whatsoever - except that they are not that powerful vs comparable level ships nor likely to ever see buffs as such under this administration.
My eccentricities are not bizarre. Is there anything else you would like to share with the classBard wrote:QUOTE (Bard @ Mar 24 2012, 07:38 PM) I realize you've already demoted yourself from "Masta"metz to "Sherriff" Metz, but the idiocy inherent in this statement indicates to me that you ought to downgrade again, from Sherriff to "Derputy".
Last edited by Mastametz on Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
There's a new sheriff in town.
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phungus420
- Posts: 78
- Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:24 am
OK, making them irritating would suck. What about giving them the scan range of pods? They'd be pretty much truly blind, but a fig couldn't park itself 400k away and fire at you invisible, but it would make the int completely dependent on support craft. I suppose that's the way I view the int.phungus420 wrote:QUOTE (phungus420 @ Mar 25 2012, 11:18 PM) I don't think it's a sweeping change. I think ints should get their original fuel back, I want ints to be the best dogfighter in the sky... but at a cost. That seems the most balanced way to do things to me, and would require less changes then any other option given. Leave ints as they are, but make them intercepters, they intercept, they aren't long range figs unless they have a scout/con/base providing them telemetry.
That'd be fine except as things are now a good fig can kill mostly kill an int outright before the int gets into firing range, so ints can't reasonably be nerfed in any way shape or form until that changes.phungus420 wrote:QUOTE (phungus420 @ Mar 26 2012, 12:30 AM) OK, making them irritating would suck. What about giving them the scan range of pods? They'd be pretty much truly blind, but a fig couldn't park itself 400k away and fire at you invisible, but it would make the int completely dependent on support craft. I suppose that's the way I view the int.
There's a new sheriff in town.
The problem here is that in order for any faction to have the ability to win, it must have some sort of offensive capabilities.
The game cannot be won by Defense alone (unless you simply make the other team quite by turtle-ing for 4 hours).
You all seem to believe that Interceptors should be Defensive craft. But, because the interceptor is the only Fighter offered by the Expansion Techpath, it also needs to have offensive capabilities.
The problem is that your trying to make one ship fit every hole. You can't do it. If you do, it becomes the best ship in the game, for everything.
So you want the Interceptor to be the best Dogfighter, and still be mostly defensively oriented. That's totally possible...by cutting off it's legs. If you drastically reduce it's effective range, you have made it a defensive fighter. Now to counter act its inability to sprint 3 sectors, you should probably give it ripcord ability. This would encourage expansion to...well...expand. Pushing teles into enemy sectors to give the Ints a limited offensive capability.
Now I'm no expert, magical, ace, dragon Sean Connery Commander mother$#@!er. But the problem is still easy enough to see. If you cut the Scan range of the int you will basically destroy any use of expansion for PUGs. We all know that.
Balance the ships to match the purpose of the Faction.
Now...you may pick apart my post in 3...2...1...
The game cannot be won by Defense alone (unless you simply make the other team quite by turtle-ing for 4 hours).
You all seem to believe that Interceptors should be Defensive craft. But, because the interceptor is the only Fighter offered by the Expansion Techpath, it also needs to have offensive capabilities.
The problem is that your trying to make one ship fit every hole. You can't do it. If you do, it becomes the best ship in the game, for everything.
So you want the Interceptor to be the best Dogfighter, and still be mostly defensively oriented. That's totally possible...by cutting off it's legs. If you drastically reduce it's effective range, you have made it a defensive fighter. Now to counter act its inability to sprint 3 sectors, you should probably give it ripcord ability. This would encourage expansion to...well...expand. Pushing teles into enemy sectors to give the Ints a limited offensive capability.
Now I'm no expert, magical, ace, dragon Sean Connery Commander mother$#@!er. But the problem is still easy enough to see. If you cut the Scan range of the int you will basically destroy any use of expansion for PUGs. We all know that.
Balance the ships to match the purpose of the Faction.
Now...you may pick apart my post in 3...2...1...
sfs can be an offensivee craft after they have wiped out the enemy's econ as they're supposed to and gotten an obvious tech advantage
so they function conceptually
ints can be offensive as a defensive craft if you push something for them to defend - like an op con, or a carrier. these things also provide them with sensors and the ability to dock for more fuel, etc. so as far as that goes, kind of function conceptually.
The problem lies in that people want their cake , and to eat it to. They don't want ints to have the mobility of figs because they are merely dogfighting craft, but it's also "not fair" when ints are better dogfighting craft, which is why ints have had the fuel economy to be roughly as mobile as figs, have mediocre sensors vs almost none at all, and also don't instantly shred everything they come across as they should; They are fighterceptors. this doesn't make sense conceptually.
like why should miniguns not do huge dmg vs util hull. If you're pushing a con against the defensive tech path, you should expect it to die, without a numbers or tech advantage. if your miners are in range of the defensive tech path, they should be instantly vaporized. that's over a very short distance.
again I'm speaking conceptually. int fuel and sensors would have to be furthermore nerfed, and int sig probably raised, but minigun power against basically everything need be buffed significantly.
another issue is PuG core balance vs SG core balance
making changes on account of one can be terrible for the other
PuG gameplay is at an all time low and absolutely terrible
however at this point at time, most squad games are basically played at PuG level, which is why Nightflame's endless bombing keeps working
and why XC even if balanced perfectly for what its intended for should never be seen in any PuG or SG anytime in the forseeable future - it's only to be played at skill cap
so they function conceptually
ints can be offensive as a defensive craft if you push something for them to defend - like an op con, or a carrier. these things also provide them with sensors and the ability to dock for more fuel, etc. so as far as that goes, kind of function conceptually.
The problem lies in that people want their cake , and to eat it to. They don't want ints to have the mobility of figs because they are merely dogfighting craft, but it's also "not fair" when ints are better dogfighting craft, which is why ints have had the fuel economy to be roughly as mobile as figs, have mediocre sensors vs almost none at all, and also don't instantly shred everything they come across as they should; They are fighterceptors. this doesn't make sense conceptually.
like why should miniguns not do huge dmg vs util hull. If you're pushing a con against the defensive tech path, you should expect it to die, without a numbers or tech advantage. if your miners are in range of the defensive tech path, they should be instantly vaporized. that's over a very short distance.
again I'm speaking conceptually. int fuel and sensors would have to be furthermore nerfed, and int sig probably raised, but minigun power against basically everything need be buffed significantly.
another issue is PuG core balance vs SG core balance
making changes on account of one can be terrible for the other
PuG gameplay is at an all time low and absolutely terrible
however at this point at time, most squad games are basically played at PuG level, which is why Nightflame's endless bombing keeps working
and why XC even if balanced perfectly for what its intended for should never be seen in any PuG or SG anytime in the forseeable future - it's only to be played at skill cap
Last edited by Mastametz on Mon Mar 26, 2012 8:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
There's a new sheriff in town.
I think to put it into LoL/DoTA/WoW terms for alien, Ints are not the speed and figs the tanks, Ints are the tanks and Figs are the burst dmg/dps/squishy, the thing is that you rarely see Ints and Figs working together but it makes sense, ints are much faster over short distances (with no tp) and have survivability to initiate fights and hold out until reinforcements arrive in the form of the hard hitting figs who also by engaging the furball and not being actively targeted can pick opponents from a good distance and make effective use of their missiles to do maximum damage, however should the figs take flak they are squishy so they die, however once the objective is complete the figs can bug out while the ints form the rearguard and the figs strike somewhere else.
For my balance would not be to nerf ints, it would be to nerf fig shields/hp and perk their dmg.
For my balance would not be to nerf ints, it would be to nerf fig shields/hp and perk their dmg.
