zimmerman trial

[Raveen]

I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't have been better if Zimmerman wasn't allowed to carry a gun. This isn't really a gun control issue but I suspect that this event would simply not have occurred if guns weren't so prevalent.

[HSharp]

Well yes if guns were more regulated/illegal then I doubt Martin would have been shot, though what is Florida's law on carrying knives?

[Raveen]

In my experience, members of neighbourhood watches don't tend to carry a knife. Even with a knife, would Zimmerman have felt confident enough to confront Martin, or would he have called the police?

As far as the court goes, there was pretty much no way that any result was going to please everyone and the court was very much sadwiched between the proverbial rock and hard place.

[raumvogel]

According to the Reddit AMA by one of Zimmermans relatives, He stopped the pursuit after the dispatcher told him not to follow Martin.

[takingarms1]

QUOTE (ShadowFoxx @ Jul 16 2013, 12:00 AM) But one thing the prosecutors failed to point out with the Florida Stand your ground law ( which has the ability to be a great law) ... is that if you are the initial aggressor ( which Zimmerman was) then you have to make every attempt to break contact. Which he did not. Instead of letting professionals come he followed a law abiding citizen creeper like, which prompted Martin to respond... as it would prompt me to respond.

Now we don't know what kind of verbal exchanges took place... but it is obvious that Zimmerman could have left at any time prior to confronting the boy, and prior to the boy responding to him.

All we *know* is that Zimmerman was following the boy. We have no idea, and the prosecutors had no way to prove, who initiated the physical confrontation. I don't think there was even enough evidence to show who initiated the confrontation verbally. I read the recount of one witness who said that it was Martin who turned around first and said, "why are you following me?" That's not prosecutor fail. That's a loser from the start, from the prosecutor's perspective.

You blame Zimmerman for not calling a professional. Why didn't Martin, who was holding a cell phone, call the cops? Why did he confront a suspicious man following him instead of calling the professionals?

Also that's not the definition of manslaughter. You don't get to manslaughter by acting negligently or doing something stupid. You have to act with a reckless disregard for another person's life. Again, there's no evidence of that here. We have a guy following another guy, and the guy being followed didn't like it. There was a confrontation. I don't think following someone on a street, and even yelling at someone or asking what they are doing, rises to the level of reckless disregard for another person's life.

I do think there's potential for a civil case against Zimmerman, because it sounds like he did act negligently and thereby caused Martin's death. But honestly even that case is somewhat shaky because Martin is a huge question mark. Normally, just following someone around and talking to them or even yelling at them shouldn't give rise to this kind of situation. We don't have evidence that Zimmerman did anything other than that, so even a simple negligence case is pretty hard to prove.

[Icky]

QUOTE (TakingArms @ Jul 16 2013, 09:59 AM) You blame Zimmerman for not calling a professional. Why didn't Martin, who was holding a cell phone, call the cops? Why did he confront a suspicious man following him instead of calling the professionals?

Because he was young, black, and in Florida. The way the shooting was handled showed that he was right, to a certain extent.

[Adept]

QUOTE (Icky @ Jul 16 2013, 12:06 AM) If a black man with a record of resisting arrest, assaulting police officers, domestic violence, and a restraining order shot a 17 year old white kid walking home you can be fairly certain they wouldn't just drop it.

+1

QUOTE (TakingArms @ Jul 16 2013, 01:34 AM) Actually, that probably wouldn't even be news.

Not news in the sense that it fits the narrative... But are you seriously suggesting that the police would have been as understanding, and the case likely to be found guilty if it was black man following and shooting a white teenager?

[takingarms1]

If Zimmerman were black and Martin were white, and all the other facts of the case remained the same, the only difference would be that nobody would care and it wouldn't be news. The verdict would still be not guilty for all the reasons outlined above that you probably didn't bother to read.

[lexaal]

QUOTE (TakingArms @ Jul 16 2013, 11:02 PM) If Zimmerman were black and Martin were white, and all the other facts of the case remained the same, the only difference would be that nobody would care and it wouldn't be news. The verdict would still be not guilty for all the reasons outlined above if the police did not shoot him down as act of self defense. - theoretically spoken-

[HSharp]

There are two sides to the story, the only thing is that you only have Zimmerman's side because Martin is dead.