Ship/base/object MDL file contents

Spinoza · Post by **Spinoza** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 5:03 pm

I found that MDL files for ship models contain several groups inside.

For example, the pattie (fig12.mdl) contains the following:
mdl_R-l-0-g-0mdl_R-l-0-g-1mdlR-l-1(LOD=64.000000)mdlR-l-2(LOD=32.000000)mdlR-l-3(LOD=8.000000)
These are:
A fully textured pattie.A tiny untextured box. (?)Same as first.Like 1st but no texture.Low poly textured model of the pattie.
Does anyone know how the game uses these?
I'm guessing some of these are supposed to be for different LOD rendering, does Alleg still support this (if it ever did)?
Does Alleg still look for the LOD groups?
What is the weird box? I found similar stuff in other models. Isolated vertices, etc. WTF?

In short, I need to know how to handle these when making changes to an MDL, not just to the associated texture file.

Andon · Post by **Andon** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 5:04 pm

You can safely ignore them - AFAIK, the game doesn't use them anymore.

madpeople · Post by **madpeople** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 6:04 pm

I thought it did if they are there? I know mdl edit does (you can bring up a slider to select LOD), and that's a stripped down version of the game engine.

The numbers (64.000 32.000 8.000) are the radius in pixles that the object on screen has to be lass than in order to use that LOD, as you can see they are quite low so you won't realy notice the change (as is intended!) but the render engine would.

Unless someone looks in the code, I read in the change log for the beta something about nvidia perfhud if that works now you might be able to use that to test

the place the groups get put in is the text .mdl described here.
There are a few varaitions on that out there, but I chose that one for the wiki as it was the most illustrative.
They are in your allegiance source >artwork >tools and match the pattern template*.mdl

KGJV · Post by **KGJV** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:39 pm

AFAIK, as MP explained, LOD are still used in the engine even with DX9 (alpha / R5) version.

You can 'force' LOD threshold by using the LOD slider (alt-j to toggle the slider while the game is in 3D mode (flying or f3 from base)).

AS for nvidia perfhud, i did add support for it but since the gfx settings dialog was removed in latest R5 I don't think you can choose the device anymore now...

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:54 pm

Why not just detect if the "PerfHUD" device is there and use that one if it is.

KGJV · Post by **KGJV** » Tue Jul 28, 2009 12:56 am

Orion wrote:QUOTE (Orion @ Jul 28 2009, 12:54 AM) Why not just detect if the "PerfHUD" device is there and use that one if it is.

may be this works like that, i dunno, I didn't try. if not then ask Imago , he did the change ....

Imago · Post by **Imago** » Tue Jul 28, 2009 2:36 am

perf hud still works

the dialog wasn't removed, use "Safe mode" to have the dialog reappear (sends -software command line switch)

or use -adapter <n> to skip the dialog and use a non-primary display adapter

all works OK

a quick review of the src/change notes would reveal this info.

note: the readme will be updated for the R5 release to explain the new features, like alliances, bandwidth settings, advanced options, restoration of command-line switches, yadda yadda

Adaven · Post by **Adaven** » Tue Jul 28, 2009 5:30 am

While you've got all the heavy hitters' attention forgive me for the following slight derail for a question that's been bugging me:

I remember in a previous Beta that Kage added a spinning logo to the start screen that was translucent and "glowy" (sort of). How was that done, and can it be replicated with in-game models?

Spinoza · Post by **Spinoza** » Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:34 am

I find it very difficult to believe the low LOD model are used by the game.
The reason is that in the few models I've examined, some of the low LOD models aren't textured at all... IDK how the game would handle those but I think people would notice the LOD change if the model changed from a textured ship to a dull grey mass or something.

I'll try the alt-j thing though.
Perhaps I'll change the LOD levels in a model test it in game.

Edit: Almost forgot, thanks for all the help! You're all winners!

Spinoza · Post by **Spinoza** » Tue Jul 28, 2009 8:27 am

Spinoza wrote:QUOTE (Spinoza @ Jul 28 2009, 10:34 AM) I find it very difficult to believe the low LOD model are used by the game.

I tested this in-game with the LOD slider and the result is thus:

The game does use the low LOD models.
IDK if this is by default, but when I brought up the LOD slider, it was at the extreme end, at which it seems low LOD models aren't used.
The low LOD models only showed up when I pulled the LOD slider way down.

It seems it would indeed be safe to ignore the low LOD models when making changes.