The EXP problem

takingarms1 · Post by **takingarms1** » Mon May 05, 2008 3:21 pm

I think the number one issue with alleg balance right now is the utter and complete dominance of EXP versus all other tech paths. What's the best way to address this problem?

My thinking is to attack this problem the way GOD core started to, by revamping costs. But we obviously need to go farther than GOD did. Sup is just too expensive versus exp for what you get.

I think the goal balance-wise should be that Sup should be able to out-expand and box in exp with tele's while being able to afford adv figs + carriers + hull, missile, and ripcord GA's. EXP should have to fight and grind for their space by pushing cons in Sup's face. And wouldn't this be more fun anyway? EXP would have more targets / furballs and sup would be ripping all over the place in shiny figs with all the toys. Smash mouth allegiance FTW!

Now what's the best way to do this? We know that small adjustments make big differences in alleg. Perhaps start out by cutting the costs of figs, carriers + hull, missile, and ripcord GA's by 30% and see what happens. Also is it possible to make it cheaper to upgrade to adv sup than it would be to upgrade to adv exp? If so, slash that by 10-20%. I'm thinking tele prices should stay the same because they are global across tech paths, and we want to give SUP an advantage without conferring one on EXP.

Thoughts?

gr4vity · Post by **gr4vity** » Mon May 05, 2008 3:51 pm

DN's Sup solution isn't the worst. The problem is that most pilots fly Fig like Ints and most Sup Coms neither get MP/Boosters/SmallShield or important GAs (depending on the faction) to make Sup competitive.

For example not buying boost2/Missile dmg+tracking as GT is like refusing to buy Mini2, Yield and Dmg GA as Exp.

This is partially the reason why Sup teams usually lose (especially vs Exp) and since they lose so often its not getting played enough for people to actually learn how to use it proper. Once people understand how easy it can be to pod HvyInts in your AdvFig with HvyBooster there might be no more problem /wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

Kltplzyxm · Post by **Kltplzyxm** » Mon May 05, 2008 4:25 pm

IMO, the biggest problem is that it's far too easy to get hvy ints. We've hashed this over before as it takes much more $$$ and time to get SUP to a similar level. To see hvy ints appear before 20min.

Out of the box, ints generally fly faster, accelerate, and turn better than figs. Perhaps these are attributes that need to be paid for, not something that comes for free. It makes less sense that something that is supposed be a flying tank be able to turn like a ferrari at a basic level.

Paradigm2 · Post by **Paradigm2** » Mon May 05, 2008 4:43 pm

I've said it over and over again... make ints ineffective outside of a controlled sector. Make them dependent on your outposts and bases.

Limiting scan range and fuel capacity I think would make a huge difference.

It is really discouraging to see that an entire team of light ints can see a con almost in a sector (two away from their home), boost there and get there in time to kill it, and have enough fuel to get home.

Edit: And making those two simple nerfs will not limit the roles of ints as defensive ships. They will still be able to defend cons and miners, even far from their home (as their top speeds are not that low), and they will still keep the same amount of ammo.

The only thing it really stops are the ridiculous notion (which I use to my advantage all the time) that a single heavy int can boost across multiple sectors, eye a miner on its own, boost around in circles while killing the miner, and boost away. Its just stupid.

Kltplzyxm · Post by **Kltplzyxm** » Mon May 05, 2008 5:06 pm

Paradigm2 wrote:QUOTE (Paradigm2 @ May 5 2008, 09:43 AM) I've said it over and over again... make ints ineffective outside of a controlled sector. Make them dependent on your outposts and bases.

The only problem is that it requires a code change and extra checking that ints can only fly in sectors where there is a con and a base first. No longer will you be able to push ints into a sector ahead of a con. I like the idea, but it might be interpreted as a little drastic.

Paradigm2 · Post by **Paradigm2** » Mon May 05, 2008 5:21 pm

Read the whole post Mr. K... I said this can be achieved effectively simply by lowering scan ranges and fuel capacity.

mcwarren4 · Post by **mcwarren4** » Mon May 05, 2008 5:50 pm

Paradigm2 wrote:QUOTE (Paradigm2 @ May 5 2008, 12:43 PM) I've said it over and over again... make ints ineffective outside of a controlled sector. Make them dependent on your outposts and bases.

Limiting scan range and fuel capacity I think would make a huge difference.

It is really discouraging to see that an entire team of light ints can see a con almost in a sector (two away from their home), boost there and get there in time to kill it, and have enough fuel to get home.

Edit: And making those two simple nerfs will not limit the roles of ints as defensive ships. They will still be able to defend cons and miners, even far from their home (as their top speeds are not that low), and they will still keep the same amount of ammo.

The only thing it really stops are the ridiculous notion (which I use to my advantage all the time) that a single heavy int can boost across multiple sectors, eye a miner on its own, boost around in circles while killing the miner, and boost away. Its just stupid.

I am mcw, and I approve this message.

Kltplzyxm · Post by **Kltplzyxm** » Mon May 05, 2008 6:01 pm

slap · Post by **slap** » Mon May 05, 2008 6:19 pm

Paradigm2 wrote:QUOTE (Paradigm2 @ May 5 2008, 09:43 AM) I've said it over and over again... make ints ineffective outside of a controlled sector. Make them dependent on your outposts and bases.

Limiting scan range and fuel capacity I think would make a huge difference.

It is really discouraging to see that an entire team of light ints can see a con almost in a sector (two away from their home), boost there and get there in time to kill it, and have enough fuel to get home.

Edit: And making those two simple nerfs will not limit the roles of ints as defensive ships. They will still be able to defend cons and miners, even far from their home (as their top speeds are not that low), and they will still keep the same amount of ammo.

The only thing it really stops are the ridiculous notion (which I use to my advantage all the time) that a single heavy int can boost across multiple sectors, eye a miner on its own, boost around in circles while killing the miner, and boost away. Its just stupid.

I agree.

takingarms1 · Post by **takingarms1** » Mon May 05, 2008 6:21 pm

Can't an int scan range nerf going be effectively negated by having scouts coming along on miner/con hunts?

I still think SUP costs should be revamped either way. That @#(! is too expensive, yo.