Allegiance's reorganization

[MagisterXF94]

Dear Allegiance community

I believe it is time to focus once again on the crucial aspects that need fixing in our community.

1. Marketing the game

We need to get the marketing machine back in motion, not just on facebook, but reddit, prominent indie game sites and journalists.
I need a serious person behind this, who is willing to organize monthly mumble meetings, and get Allegiance out there with the help of other volunteers.

2. “Where is R8”?

R8 is still in need of fixing but more importantly, TESTING! I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH!
I need a team of members with the following prerequisites:
-A minimal knowledge of the issues that need testing
-Patience,lots of it.
-Multiple machines with different hardware configurations (laptops apply as well).
-Willingness to spend multiple Sundays testing issues.
-Being able to send crash dumps to other testers and the main developer.

If you have the aforementioned requirements PM me.

But what does the R8 release include?

-New web based installer that automatically downloads up to date files on the user’s computer at install.
-Full high res texture support.
-The original Allegiance Zone system has been rebuilt and integrated with ACSS
-Cort UI has been implemented by default

3.

The dreaded default keymap

Sixteen years after release, I believe we must tackle this difficult task.

This won’t be easy, because reaching a consensus between mouse and joystick users has always proven difficult.

However, we must at least, be able to provide a solid control base that the new player can customize further.









4.

Events

I’m preparing something special, but any commanders who wish to schedule matches, can use the gameplay section to do so, once the match is finalized, myself or Dome will post it on the news section. Get on it.

5.

Where is “Alleg2”?

Last I heard from Djole, alleg 2 is currently on hold due to lack of time. He is currently contemplating switching to Unreal Engine 4 for development.


6 Joystick precision bug issue

Wasp has done an amazing job in investigating this issue that has been a plague to us since R5. For more info read the following topic: http://www.freeallegiance.org/forums/index...amp;hl=joystick

Joystick users report your findings in the topic linked above.



That is all! I will create appropriate topics for each of the things I mentioned shortly.

Blacksun

[Wasp]

I believe that any effort whatsoever is a complete waste of time when you build that effort upon such a poor foundation.

The game is broken. This is not a theory or some sort of "joystick bug". It is BROKEN because it was built that way. Dx9 is a different game than those builds before it and ever since Dx9 (R5) was released, we have continued to build upon that broken crap.

Doofus introduced this in build 197 and anyone can test this for themselves to see that it is right there that the game was screwed. I posted two clients from the same build 197 where one is Dx9 and the other is Dx7. You can easily see the problem when you compare them side by side. Precision in the controllers were lost (this includes mice although it's less noticible than joysticks/controllers), frame rates are all over the place. Ships jump and stutter which can be seen in ANY of our videos. Shots fired don't register. Physics and rendering are out of sync even with vsync on in-game and even forced-on via graphic drivers. The input lag is unbearable, you move your controller and have tea while waiting for it to respond.

The game in its current state is an embarrassment and not something that should be advertised. Nothing should be contemplated until the foundation is fixed first!

Without knowing specifically what in that Dx9 build that Doofus submitted is breaking things, I suspect that it is a Time Step problem. Kage said he'd look into it, haven't heard from him since.

All the other coders involved in that project are gone, Kage is the only one left (that I know of).

[MagisterXF94]

QUOTE (Wasp @ Aug 8 2016, 08:19 PM) I believe that any effort whatsoever is a complete waste of time when you build that effort upon such a poor foundation.

The game is broken. This is not a theory or some sort of "joystick bug". It is BROKEN because it was built that way. Dx9 is a different game than those builds before it and ever since Dx9 (R5) was released, we have continued to build upon that broken crap.

Doofus introduced this in build 197 and anyone can test this for themselves to see that it is right there that the game was screwed. I posted two clients from the same build 197 where one is Dx9 and the other is Dx7. You can easily see the problem when you compare them side by side. Precision in the controllers were lost (this includes mice although it's less noticible than joysticks/controllers), frame rates are all over the place. Ships jump and stutter which can be seen in ANY of our videos. Shots fired don't register. Physics and rendering are out of sync even with vsync on in-game and even forced-on via graphic drivers. The input lag is unbearable, you move your controller and have tea while waiting for it to respond.

The game in its current state is an embarrassment and not something that should be advertised. Nothing should be contemplated until the foundation is fixed first!

Without knowing specifically what in that Dx9 build that Doofus submitted is breaking things, I suspect that it is a Time Step problem. Kage said he'd look into it, haven't heard from him since.



All the other coders involved in that project are gone, Kage is the only one left (that I know of).

Very well then, can we revert build 197?
PKK?

[Wasp]

QUOTE (Senor NoirSol @ Aug 8 2016, 03:14 PM) Very well then, can we revert build 197? PKK?

I don't think it's that simple.

Kage suggested that things could be "back ported" however, it would take a lot of work. I don't think he's willing or has time to do it.

It appears that what is wrong in the Dx9 build is beyond the understanding of all the Devs (no insults intended). Dogbones was the first one to proclaim (back in 2009) that the problems we were experiencing was due to the increased frame rates. I didn't understand at the time what he meant but after reading dozens of forums where developers were faced with these very problems, I can see that it would take some serious coders to find what's wrong and fix it.

If your next reply is "lets get some coders", let me remind you that this environment is hostile to coders / volunteers.

[Wasp]

Here's where the problem was introduced. Both clients exist in the solution so you can pick which client (dx7 or dx9) to use.

With that much change (18k additions), in a single commit, it's no wonder it's screwed up.

I would expect that kind of coding from Ubisoft but, not from FAO.

[KGJV]

still here. busy atm.

2 things:

- the js/lag issue was never top priority because js users weren't majority (or at least they never voiced they were and that issue was important for them as Wasp is doing now). In terms of priority/important stuff to fix in the game in order to bring new people in i'm not sure it's very high. I don't think "potential new players" have js or will buy js to play Alleg. kb/mouse and gamepads are current input devices of the 'modern' age, so i'm not sure wasting time & resource on fixing js is worthy. Fix default keymap 1st.


QUOTE - this environment is hostile to coders / volunteers[/quote]
right on it. The #1 issue with this game is its community and has always been. Fix that 1st (or scratch it and start over with new people, new web site, new servers, etc).

[Wasp]

QUOTE (KGJV @ Aug 10 2016, 05:50 AM) - the js/lag issue was never top priority because js users weren't majority (or at least they never voiced they were and that issue was important for them as Wasp is doing now). In terms of priority/important stuff to fix in the game in order to bring new people in i'm not sure it's very high...

Let me say once again, this is NOT a js/lag issue. This is a build 197 issue where Doofus introduced a whole new game and replaced the existing one. That dysfunctional code reveals itself in CONTROLLERS (js, mice, etc..), network, turrets, jumping ships, unregistered shots...

Many voiced their observations and they were ignored by those who were responsible for that Dx9 project. Sheff lost his js precision, aarm did too, I did, Raindog can't hit @#(! now even with his high precision mouse (and he was the ONLY one who could keep up with me in a turret). Oh yea, if you have ANY doubt about this broken game, jump on a turret. You want to tell me that the turret issue is just a joystick thing?!

The "js/lag" issue was never top priority because those who were responsible for the Dx9 project were incapable of understanding the reason why their code didn't work, so they turned their head or tried to redirect attention to something trivial (keymaps) - like Kage is doing now.

Again, this isn't a matter of fixing a js problem. It's about developing code that isn't flawed at such a fundamental level before putting it in place where everyone is affected negatively.

Developers here have a habit of doing exactly what Kage is doing. Ignoring the feedback from those who reveal their flawed code or discounting it as just a "js bug". I took the time to narrow it down to the very build where it all started and it still goes ignored.

When faced with a problem bigger than their ability to correct, the devs pushed their code anyway and stuck their head in the sand when the helpline flooded with complaints.

Kage is right about one thing though, this game will never see any development / advancement until EVERYONE who is in the position to screw it over, are removed.

[MagisterXF94]

But now that we have have found that the bulid 197 has been the source of many issues, what can we in practice do to fix it?

I am in no means deeming what are you saying here, my only goal is to help allegiance grow.

[Wasp]

QUOTE (Senor NoirSol @ Aug 10 2016, 10:32 AM) But now that we have have found that the bulid 197 has been the source of many issues, what can we in practice do to fix it?

We install visual studio, build the clients, compare, acknowledge that it is indeed broken, fix and test (that is a continues process) until it is resolved. Again, I suspect this is a time step issue which explains why it's hitting us across the board in so many areas. One of the most obvious places where time step problems reveal themselves is in the input / response behavior. I suggest you read that page on time steps.

I'm not certain and Kage never answered my earlier questions regarding changes in time step between R4 and R5. As I recall someone mentioning, the physics and rendering were decoupled in R5.


QUOTE I am in no means deeming what are you saying here, my only goal is to help allegiance grow.[/quote]
Dude, that is what we all want however, as you can clearly see, that goal is a pipe dream with the current environment.

Here's how you "FIX" everything.

Move Allegiance.

[MagisterXF94]

QUOTE (Wasp @ Aug 10 2016, 04:52 PM) We install visual studio, build the clients, compare, acknowledge that it is indeed broken, fix and test (that is a continues process) until it is resolved. Again, I suspect this is a time step issue which explains why it's hitting us across the board in so many areas. One of the most obvious places where time step problems reveal themselves is in the input / response behavior. I suggest you read that page on time steps.

I'm not certain and Kage never answered my earlier questions regarding changes in time step between R4 and R5. As I recall someone mentioning, the physics and rendering were decoupled in R5.



Dude, that is what we all want however, as you can clearly see, that goal is a pipe dream with the current environment.

Here's how you "FIX" everything.

Move Allegiance.

lets bulid the exe with code before 197 and aftewards. Kage would you be willing to help us in this endeavour?