heres an idea masta, make your own core and call it #draw core
see how many play it
Sup too powerful in CC07
Here's an idea, instead of normal server and noob server, we have SKILL server and DUMBASS server
on the SKILL server our 5v5 will be of higher quality than your 15 vs 15s on the DUMBASS server.
plus, games should be part conquest and dm anyway
if you're getting whored into the ground you should lose just for that reason eventually
on the SKILL server our 5v5 will be of higher quality than your 15 vs 15s on the DUMBASS server.
If both teams let all their miners die, neither deserves to win.jyppa wrote:Turning off paydays could result in the hilarious scenario of both teams having less than 4k in the bank, no miners and no game ending tech. Turn off treasures as well and you have an endless deathmatch.
plus, games should be part conquest and dm anyway
if you're getting whored into the ground you should lose just for that reason eventually
Last edited by Mastametz on Sat Nov 14, 2009 1:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
There's a new sheriff in town.
It is a setting you have in game options screen as the commander.Mastametz wrote:QUOTE (Mastametz @ Nov 13 2009, 08:21 PM) DO IT
$#@!ing remove floating cash, remove treasures, and remove paydays
then if you let all your miners die, the game is over
as it should be
make it so
I'm sorry I don't remember any of it. For you the day spideycw graced your squad with utter destruction was the most important day of your life. But for me, it was Sunday
Idanmel wrote:QUOTE (Idanmel @ Mar 19 2012, 05:54 AM) I am ashamed for all the drama I caused, I have much to learn on how to behave when things don't go my way.
My apologies.
I misread your post.spideycw wrote:QUOTE (spideycw @ Nov 13 2009, 05:32 PM) It is a setting you have in game options screen as the commander.
I thought you were telling me to "removing treasures and floating cash" to allow for the possibility of the stalemate scenario.
didn't know that treasures included cash though.
Last edited by Mastametz on Sat Nov 14, 2009 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
There's a new sheriff in town.
I think the game would benefit from Bios paydays being nerfed, but not nearly as much as Masta is suggesting. No faction should be able to survive without miners, but at the same time, removing paydays is way too harsh - as long as the total benefit gained from paydays is low enough compared to the benefits the other team gains from their mining income, the team with no miners will be at a massive disadvantage, and the loss of the minerless team will be inevitable. Indeed, that's what currently happens with most teams, and the effect of a total lack of miners is pretty visible even with Bios - the issue is that since their research costs are halved but they still gain money at the same rate as every other faction, their credits are worth twice as much as any other faction's credits. Thus, completely preventing them from mining is not a guarantee of success, but rather the minimum necessary to have a chance at success aside from early-game rushes, because their paydays are worth twice as much as their opponents' paydays (and often even more, since several factions have reduced paydays, and only one has increased paydays, assuming the Academy's accurate). I wouldn't say "half", really, since while that's accurate if you're just talking about tech, it doesn't take into account the fact that Bios' build costs are normal. But maybe 70%? Looking at the other factions with similarly decreased tech costs (particularly TF, which also has lower research cost and higher research times, and Belts, which needs to research fewer things), there's a trend of "less money spent on tech = less starting money and lower paydays and therefore higher reliance on miners", with Bios being the only major obvious exception (possibly GT as well, but I have no idea how much effect the extra bases and slightly worse miners have; no one ever plays Ga'T, though, so I'd guess the numbers aren't in its favor). This isn't just number-crunching, either, I've been on teams that managed to completely crush Bios' mining capacity and keep it gone, and Bios survives maybe a bit too well on paydays alone.
The other thing Masta said, before he got sidetracked with his weird "no paydays" crusade, was surprisingly accurate, though. Resurrecting the quote...
[quote=""Mastametz""]The quality of players HAS degraded that far. But don't work on dumbing things down. What needs to happen is that people that DON'T SUCK at flying need to teach the new players how to fly. All the infinite pages on alleg theory this and numbers that doesn't mean a GOD DAMN thing when you eat a dumbfire in your face, or a prox, and float home. Except maybe you'll be able to know off the top of your head how close your pod can get to a probe without getting eyed.
I'll do it my god damn self if I have to, and I'm a crummy pilot, but relative to what I'm seeing in games, I'm a god. and it's pitiful.[/quote]
Honestly, being a newer pilot, I notice the same thing, both in myself and in others. Sure, there's the Cadet program, but I learned more from Cadet I before I enrolled in the program than I did during it. And while Cadet II is supposedly much better, I'll probably have learned half the content by the time the next session opens up, almost solely due to vets getting fed up at my constant screwups despite being otherwise pretty competent (by PUG standards) and correcting me over and over and over. And some of the stuff in Cadet II is just too damn essential to be hidden away in a program that only takes applicants once every two months. For example, how to properly do one's job in a tp2 attack (commanders aren't happy when multiple figbees are left behind because they didn't launch till the probe activated), or how to do anything in a SF besides be stealthy (tac teams in PUGs aren't common, but they're not once-in-two-months uncommon). And yet, having to figure out the former by trial-and-error (and being yelled at a lot by angry vets) and still getting used to the latter (in tac games I'm usually in a scout, giving me no opportunity to feel out the SF for myself), I'm STILL at least average by PUG standards, which is pretty sad. Player skills are a factor in game balance, albeit a small one.
As things are now, it's hard to say "if their miners die, they should instalose", because in any given PUG team, at least a quarter of the pilots are going to ignore the miners altogether, and another quarter are experienced pilots who are busy with important tasks (like hunting miners or probing critical sectors) and are more often than not the only people on the team who care about doing those things (so if they're forced to sit on miners because no one else will, the team suffers elsewhere). Of the half that are willing to D miners, most of them are going to be more likely to run off and do whatever the commander's asking people to do at the moment, leaving usually only 1-3 people total on miner D, often inexperienced. Not to mention that in my experience, the more skilled pilots tend to be on miner O rather than miner D.
The other thing Masta said, before he got sidetracked with his weird "no paydays" crusade, was surprisingly accurate, though. Resurrecting the quote...
[quote=""Mastametz""]The quality of players HAS degraded that far. But don't work on dumbing things down. What needs to happen is that people that DON'T SUCK at flying need to teach the new players how to fly. All the infinite pages on alleg theory this and numbers that doesn't mean a GOD DAMN thing when you eat a dumbfire in your face, or a prox, and float home. Except maybe you'll be able to know off the top of your head how close your pod can get to a probe without getting eyed.
I'll do it my god damn self if I have to, and I'm a crummy pilot, but relative to what I'm seeing in games, I'm a god. and it's pitiful.[/quote]
Honestly, being a newer pilot, I notice the same thing, both in myself and in others. Sure, there's the Cadet program, but I learned more from Cadet I before I enrolled in the program than I did during it. And while Cadet II is supposedly much better, I'll probably have learned half the content by the time the next session opens up, almost solely due to vets getting fed up at my constant screwups despite being otherwise pretty competent (by PUG standards) and correcting me over and over and over. And some of the stuff in Cadet II is just too damn essential to be hidden away in a program that only takes applicants once every two months. For example, how to properly do one's job in a tp2 attack (commanders aren't happy when multiple figbees are left behind because they didn't launch till the probe activated), or how to do anything in a SF besides be stealthy (tac teams in PUGs aren't common, but they're not once-in-two-months uncommon). And yet, having to figure out the former by trial-and-error (and being yelled at a lot by angry vets) and still getting used to the latter (in tac games I'm usually in a scout, giving me no opportunity to feel out the SF for myself), I'm STILL at least average by PUG standards, which is pretty sad. Player skills are a factor in game balance, albeit a small one.
As things are now, it's hard to say "if their miners die, they should instalose", because in any given PUG team, at least a quarter of the pilots are going to ignore the miners altogether, and another quarter are experienced pilots who are busy with important tasks (like hunting miners or probing critical sectors) and are more often than not the only people on the team who care about doing those things (so if they're forced to sit on miners because no one else will, the team suffers elsewhere). Of the half that are willing to D miners, most of them are going to be more likely to run off and do whatever the commander's asking people to do at the moment, leaving usually only 1-3 people total on miner D, often inexperienced. Not to mention that in my experience, the more skilled pilots tend to be on miner O rather than miner D.
