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Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:35 pm
by Tontow
BTW, Dose everyone Like the current labels?
OR
Would everyone Like the labeles to apear on the image as thay do in the game?
Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:09 pm
by madpeople
on could be cool, it doesn't matter too much
dont really need it to say the coordinates, though while still being developed they may be useful to describe how to trigger a bug
Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:32 pm
by batman
I liked it so far. Looks like you are on the right track. Lables on pics would be good. Also, is there a 'logical' way to color code the lines connecting the tech paths?
Even better -- if you know you want something, will you be able to click on it and get the tech tree path for building it, i.e., you wan med assualt shield 3 in phoenix, can you click on the shiled and see the tech path?
This is great way to visualize the tech tree -- and this is good stuff. Thanks for doing it.
Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 11:15 pm
by Tontow
madpeople wrote:QUOTE (madpeople @ Jan 4 2007, 02:09 PM) on could be cool, it doesn't matter too much
dont really need it to say the coordinates, though while still being developed they may be useful to describe how to trigger a bug
Ok, I'll add an option to put the labes on the image in a later release.
batman wrote:QUOTE (batman @ Jan 4 2007, 02:32 PM) I liked it so far. Looks like you are on the right track. Lables on pics would be good. Also, is there a 'logical' way to color code the lines connecting the tech paths?
Even better -- if you know you want something, will you be able to click on it and get the tech tree path for building it, i.e., you wan med assualt shield 3 in phoenix, can you click on the shiled and see the tech path?
This is great way to visualize the tech tree -- and this is good stuff. Thanks for doing it.
Highlighting the Arrows of the tech path is a good idea; I'll put it on my todo list.
In the mean time, I have a treat for everyone.
Semi-major update: /mrgreen.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="mrgreen.gif" />
Tontow’s Graphic Tech Tree Reference Generator (Alpha V0.02)
http://www.geocities.com/tontow_merlin/index.htm
Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 11:47 pm
by madpeople
new version seems to have broken the options / settings form, it has no effect now.
but things did make sense in that i could see how things were layed out.
problem is allegiance tech tree is very wide and not very deep.
i have a plan that is getting a bit late to explain, but columbs
Code: Select all
-----------------------------------------_--_--_--_--_--_--_--_--gar
/ |(*star) / /
adv scout -> hvy scout -----sup -> adv sup exp -> adv exp
ss2 ->ss3 ---------------/ enh fig -> adv fig int -> hvy int
__________/ gat 2 -> gat 3 mini 2 -> mini 3
/ dis 2 -> dis 3
cm2 -> cm3 \_> galvs
df 2 -> df 3
etc -> etc
where i put the (*star) it was ment to go on the line below underneath the | but i screwed up.
everything is layed out correctly in this reply box, if it gets moved around in the post, choose the "reply" option to see what i was trying to draw"
edit, OMG its replaced all my spaces with tabs AAAAHHH!!!!!!! my beautifull ascii picture
heres a picture, roughly
oh bugger, i missed a line to the exp from gar
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 1:02 am
by Tontow
madpeople wrote:QUOTE (madpeople @ Jan 4 2007, 03:47 PM) new version seems to have broken the options / settings form, it has no effect now.
but things did make sense in that i could see how things were layed out.
problem is allegiance tech tree is very wide and not very deep.
i have a plan that is getting a bit late to explain, but columbs
heres a picture, roughly
oh bugger, i missed a line to the exp from gar
There isn't much I can do about Allegiance's Tech Tree being very wide but not very deep, but I think I might be able to tweak View all to aligh the tech a little better. In the mean time, useing the mouse to move stuff will have to do for now.
Thanks for the input so far. The more input, the better the program will get.
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 9:00 am
by fermi
I glanced your software so far while i was preparing and looking to do something similar...
Due to my unskilled abilities, i was however unable to interpret it.
Preferably a 3 dimensional presentation would contribute to more transparency. <like in the old-fashioned
Ascendancy> However this is tough to program (is it?)
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 12:28 pm
by Tontow
fermi wrote:QUOTE (fermi @ Jan 5 2007, 01:00 AM) I glanced your software so far while i was preparing and looking to do something similar...
Due to my unskilled abilities, i was however unable to interpret it.
Preferably a 3 dimensional presentation would contribute to more transparency. <like in the old-fashioned
Ascendancy>
Arrows that point from the bottom of tech A to the top of tech B show what needs to be researched in order to get to tech B.
However, If an arrow is pointing to the bottom of a tech then there is another way (that requires more tech) for the tech to be researched; Most of the time you will see this on stations and there upgraded versions but there can be other tech that do the same. IE: Garrison and Advance Garrison can both research a bomber, Garrison points to the top of the tech, Advance Garrison points to the bottom since it means taking at least one more step to get to the bomber.
QUOTE However this is tough to program (is it?)[/quote]
More tedious then tough, Its written in Visual Basic 6.0 and the source code is included, take a look at the modules and class modules - that's where all the tech tree stuff is, practically all the stuff in the main form code is for the Hard To Do GUI.
But if you know the Pre-Def system then the only hard part is trying to get the tech to display correctly.
Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 3:00 pm
by madpeople
what i was trying to describe last night was something a little like this
top line is things you can build without a gar (gar, ops teles etc)
next is things you can build with a gar, sup tac exp pali rs
next line is things you can build when you have one of the the thing above (adv sup tac exp)
below those in columns are the techs in those respective bases.
since putting things in columns means gat 2, df 2 dis 2, enh fighters are all in sup, they don't need lines from sup to them (reduce complexity)
something i missed on the illustration
in the basic columb for sup tac exp and gar there should be an "upgrade sup tac exp gar" research, which has a line to the next coulumb headder, as you need the research upgrade sup to build a adv sup
something i put into that pic, lines aren't just straight, they are only vertical and horizontal and are at different heights to not touch each other.
perhaps instead of just going to/coming from the middle, if multiple lines start at or end on a piece of tech then then each line starts or ends 1 or 2px away from the next one, to help separate the lines.
add an ok button to the settings / options which causes the current thing to be re-drawn with the new settings applied
Posted: Sun Jan 07, 2007 4:42 am
by Tontow
madpeople wrote:QUOTE (madpeople @ Jan 5 2007, 07:00 AM) what i was trying to describe last night was something a little like this
top line is things you can build without a gar (gar, ops teles etc)
next is things you can build with a gar, sup tac exp pali rs
next line is things you can build when you have one of the the thing above (adv sup tac exp)
below those in columns are the techs in those respective bases.
since putting things in columns means gat 2, df 2 dis 2, enh fighters are all in sup, they don't need lines from sup to them (reduce complexity)
True, that would help, I'll see what I can do.
QUOTE something i missed on the illustration
in the basic columb for sup tac exp and gar there should be an "upgrade sup tac exp gar" research, which has a line to the next coulumb headder, as you need the research upgrade sup to build a adv sup[/quote]That would work for tech that requires only 1 tech to be reshearched, but how do you sugest I handle techs that isnt as simple to get (IE: stelth bombers)
QUOTE something i put into that pic, lines aren't just straight, they are only vertical and horizontal and are at different heights to not touch each other.[/quote]
They still touch in your example, but I might be able to come up with something to avoid that in a later version, but your example fits with my original goal of outputting something like
http://www.allegacademy.org/assets/gigatechtree.jpg
QUOTE perhaps instead of just going to/coming from the middle, if multiple lines start at or end on a piece of tech then then each line starts or ends 1 or 2px away from the next one, to help separate the lines.[/quote]Take a closer look at the last update /mrgreen.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="mrgreen.gif" /> , I could put more space in between them or let the user specify the amount of space between the lines; which do you think would be best?
QUOTE add an ok button to the settings / options which causes the current thing to be re-drawn with the new settings applied[/quote]
Done, I'll just call the same function that view all tech uses.
