Biden Crushes Ryan

[CronoDroid]

QUOTE (bigbellydude @ Oct 13 2012, 07:47 PM) And for all the Anti-Romney-ites out there, I really hope you have been checking Romney's website over the last few months. I'm fairly sure that his statements on that website haven't changed. And either way, if they have changed it is because he actually listens to the American people.

I look forward to crushing you all in combat soon. Slinkies...

The website that the vast majority of voters will never peruse under any circumstances. Voters by and large don't actually care about the truth, this election has proved it. Romney has flip-flopped so many times I can't even keep track. What he's SAID is completely different from what's written, and that's assuming that what's written is actually his policy. Nobody really knows, that's the scary part. Like Stephen Colbert says, Mitt seems like a good Moderate Republican AND a Radical Republican at the same time.

"Actually listens to the American people" sounds like "conservative" code for "will say or do anything necessary to fool the electorate and win the Presidency."

Quote "conservative" because no actual conservative could support a party that now advocates the complete de-regulation of the financial sector, tax breaks for everyone including the very wealthiest individuals, opposes a 39 year old Supreme Court decision, wants to go back on rights won for women over the last 100 years, opposes any and almost every form of social welfare, calls for intrusion into the personal lives of the citizenry, supports an enormous and unsustainable military budget and generally has a reactionary outlook on the vast majority of social and economic issues currently facing the country. Conservatives also preach about personal responsibility, morals and principles. But I guess it's okay to look the other way when we have evidence of both Romney and Ryan lying their pants off as long as they get elected, right?

The party is no longer conservative, because that would imply that it's moderate and anti-radical. Small government is conservative. Obamacare is conservative health care reform. When you have spokespersons like Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck and Donald Trump who are extremely reactionary, you do not have a conservative party.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPgfzknYd20
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZfXvFAeHVo

[Camaro]

QUOTE (CronoDroid @ Oct 13 2012, 06:20 PM) The party is no longer conservative, because that would imply that it's moderate and anti-radical. Small government is conservative. Obamacare is conservative health care reform. When you have spokespersons like Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck and Donald Trump who are extremely reactionary, you do not have a conservative party.

"Conservative" just means opposes change.

The Democratic Party used to be the Conservative Party you know.

[CronoDroid]

QUOTE (Camaro @ Oct 13 2012, 08:24 PM) "Conservative" just means opposes change.

The Democratic Party used to be the Conservative Party you know.

Not exactly, conservatives aren't against change per se but believe that change should happen at a very slow, methodical pace after careful deliberation from society to see if the change has become the social norm. I use Roe v. Wade as an example because it's been American case law for almost 40 years now, which is almost two full generations ago. Reversing this when it has become a socially accepted part of American culture is reactionary (pretty much the antithesis of conservative). I can understand conservative opposition to recognizing gay rights, because that is new and strange for many. The vast majority of so-called conservatives understand that homosexuality exists in reality but are mostly confused about whether it's a sin, immoral, a disease or a choice.

Obamacare is basically the next step up from the previous system; it's driven by market forces and relies upon individuals making the conscious decision to obtain some version of health insurance that they will be mandated to buy. Health insurance consumers are offered a choice. This is really in stark contrast to many universal health care systems where you will always have a minimum level of care provided for by the government. The US isn't there yet.

Conservatism is fundamentally anti-radical. It's in the name. Conservative means "a small amount". As I said, the Republican Party bares very little resemblance to what we in political science would call a "conservative" party. And yes, I realize the Democratic Party used to be conservative in regards to certain *cough* Southern issues. This is my field after all.