CC 13 Preview

Vortrog · Post by **Vortrog** » Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:49 pm

Yesterdays 3 hour Exp vs Exp borefest made me appreciate XC again over CC in the instances of PUGs.

TurkeyXIII · Post by **TurkeyXIII** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:08 am

You didn't like my 3 hour borefest?

Phalanxe · Post by **Phalanxe** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:08 am

rix sucks balls even further than before

Raven_42 · Post by **Raven_42** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:17 pm

Can we get a comprehensive delta now of cc_12 -> cc_13c? I have to say, I think breaking rixs early miner o with basic figs is a mistake, they don't seem to have got much in compensation. maybe 2k saved on srs in an average opening. Those srs are only going to be potent if can keep them behind enemy lines and get enh figs up early enough, which is typically a pain for rix (buy enh figs, do same damage as before).

grarrgrarr · Post by **grarrgrarr** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:19 pm

I think the nerf to rix is unnecessary and would cause rix to be totally unplayed faction now.

Now that Rix starts with scouts and missile-less figs for the opening really causes them to be underpowered, even more so than in XC where at least they have light interceptors.

Removing Mini-AC scout is also removing half the fun of the faction! Just ask terran!

Phalanxe · Post by **Phalanxe** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:43 pm

Raven_42 wrote:QUOTE (Raven_42 @ Dec 15 2011, 06:17 AM) Can we get a comprehensive delta now of cc_12 -> cc_13c? I have to say, I think breaking rixs early miner o with basic figs is a mistake, they don't seem to have got much in compensation. maybe 2k saved on srs in an average opening. Those srs are only going to be potent if can keep them behind enemy lines and get enh figs up early enough, which is typically a pain for rix (buy enh figs, do same damage as before).

even then figs hardly ripped to the scouts dunno if my team was rather retard though.

Raven_42 · Post by **Raven_42** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:59 pm

Also, you waiting till you have ironed out a few things before getting this on Mach? SlayerS is sometimes playable, but often temperamental with packet loss, and bad connection for euro players.

Spunkmeyer · Post by **Spunkmeyer** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:51 pm

It's not really a nerf - if you guys get sup up you'll see it's more powerful than before (hence the need for the charger to reign it in a bit) but of course this will happen in bigger games only.

If you look at the non-sup opening game and objectively compare to other factions (rather than what it was before): you lose missiles, but you get the ability to easily put two or more scout guns on anything the scout comes across. Several gat 1 (+ @#(!ton of prox) on the miner/const is more powerful than missiles.

So part of the problem is you are used to the DN way of doing things, and the other part is games are smaller. This kind of Rix opening works a lot better with larger games, since you have many more rip scouts around. Conversely it's worse for smaller games where it's trivial to spend the 500 for an SR scout for everyone.

So, yes, since the games are smaller it may end up being a nerf for pickup games and we may need to reverse it. Meanwhile give it a spin at least if you intend to go sup or if you are playing a larger game. It will not fail in a 10vs10 if you know what's going on.

Raven_42 · Post by **Raven_42** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 11:46 am

Its definitely a nerf, in the hypothetical larger game you can (reasonably) expect more resistance on con d, including fighters/ints, scouts can't reasonably engage them. Therefore you cant expect often to 'easily' put multiple scout guns on a target. Unlike for example, TF, where u have 2 scout guns on a target for the cost of one pilots flight time. Or any faction with opening ints, where they have a significant advantage in taking down defending Fig/Ints, and hunting down nans. So rix has the added expenses for getting all their tech up, and no real early game sting any more. By the time Enh figs are up, the enemy can already have a lot of (relative to previous rix) easy mining going on, the point of Rix was EARLY econ damage. I agree, the scouts do have an advantage now they are sneakier, so the midgame miner o can be more of a surprise, and they have saved the comm some cash, but that doesn't come close to compensating them for what they have lost.

At least this fixes reg scouts ripping to srs, to some extent.

But I have to re-iterate, getting the low value Rix sup up to be able to do what you used to do from game start, with the delay for tech con, and the cost, is inescapably a nerf. Rix figs are kinda poor for base d (no dumbfire+gat spike on bbrs, u are easy turret meat.

But I guess its worth getting this version a few more games under its belt, so these factors become more commonly observed.

Also, in previous versions, even with a larger game, u didnt really need SRs for everyone, only for as many directions as u wanted covered. Doesnt change much from a small game.

phungus420 · Post by **phungus420** » Fri Dec 16, 2011 4:40 pm

We played this all day yesterday. Small games, but still that's all there is now.

Rix is horrible.

Dreg is also very weak, which is a problem with XC as well. They start nice due to their ship's quickness and as the game progresses they become simply outgunned by everything; this was balanced with the old models that made them unhittable - but that was terrible design; consider some way to buff Dreg (maybe reduce their costs?)

Fig mass reduction is nice, and noticeable. Though you might consider giving them all a bit more fuel capacity as well.

There is a bug for Rix. When Cloak 2 is researched the energy recharger is obsoleted and no longer available for rix scouts.