MrC --
The rapidly declining active playerbase #'s disagree with you that people are still playing Alleg whilst moving into other phases of their lives =P
attendance
We actually have a fairly large inflow... but most of it runs right off the hands, into the drain. Between a (hopefully) more active dev team and the marketing team, we can bring some new life into this place 
TB
TB
[18:48] <Imago> dont take me seriouslyspideycw wrote:QUOTE (spideycw @ Nov 28 2008, 02:50 PM) All the retards are contained in one squad mostly (System X)
Bacon, I agree with both you and MrC.
Retention/Inflow is going to get harder as time goes on without serious input into the game. I've seen my own time to play plummet between family/work/school. The "grow-up" factor is certainly real. When my wife goes into labor early february (hopefully not sooner), that will be like the 5th XT child in as many months. I think my best bet at playing again will then be getting my kid hooked on Alleg in ~12 years so that squad games count as family bonding.
So I hope Alleg's still around that long. Like you said, it won't be easy. However I think there is hope as MrC said: games like Starcraft and Quake3 are still alive and kickin' and are older than alleg. So it can be done.
A total graphics revamp would be a big piece of the puzzle. I'm trying to do my part by taking a couple extra classes to improve my coding and art skills.
I'm also excited about what the marketing team is getting ready to do.
Retention/Inflow is going to get harder as time goes on without serious input into the game. I've seen my own time to play plummet between family/work/school. The "grow-up" factor is certainly real. When my wife goes into labor early february (hopefully not sooner), that will be like the 5th XT child in as many months. I think my best bet at playing again will then be getting my kid hooked on Alleg in ~12 years so that squad games count as family bonding.
So I hope Alleg's still around that long. Like you said, it won't be easy. However I think there is hope as MrC said: games like Starcraft and Quake3 are still alive and kickin' and are older than alleg. So it can be done.
A total graphics revamp would be a big piece of the puzzle. I'm trying to do my part by taking a couple extra classes to improve my coding and art skills.
I'm also excited about what the marketing team is getting ready to do.
Last edited by Adaven on Thu Dec 10, 2009 3:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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We should also start considering selling Alleg from a different viewpoint.
It could start being considered RETRO, not only an underdog.
(I remember that's how I found out about the game, that 'the-underdogs' site for abandonware... problem is Alleg wasn't popular enough to be retro, went straight to DVD, but make it the Donnie Darko of games and we're in business)
It could start being considered RETRO, not only an underdog.
(I remember that's how I found out about the game, that 'the-underdogs' site for abandonware... problem is Alleg wasn't popular enough to be retro, went straight to DVD, but make it the Donnie Darko of games and we're in business)
One short sleep past, we wake eternally and Death shalt be no more; Death, thou shalt die! 
I got it!Adaven wrote:QUOTE (Adaven @ Dec 10 2009, 03:51 AM) Bacon, I agree with both you and MrC.
Retention/Inflow is going to get harder as time goes on without serious input into the game. I've seen my own time to play plummet between family/work/school. The "grow-up" factor is certainly real. When my wife goes into labor early february (hopefully not sooner), that will be like the 5th XT child in as many months. I think my best bet at playing again will then be getting my kid hooked on Alleg in ~12 years so that squad games count as family bonding.
So I hope Alleg's still around that long. Like you said, it won't be easy. However I think there is hope as MrC said: games like Starcraft and Quake3 are still alive and kickin' and are older than alleg. So it can be done.
A total graphics revamp would be a big piece of the puzzle. I'm trying to do my part by taking a couple extra classes to improve my coding and art skills.
I'm also excited about what the marketing team is getting ready to do.
KOREAN LAUNCH!
shutup bard!
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I don't see the graphics as being that bad, and even if they were, it wouldn't drive people off as much as y'all seem to think. Look at the popularity of Dwarf Fortress. It's the gameplay that matters; graphics' "OOH SHINY ME WANT PLAY" factor isn't that big even on the consoles, let alone in the "free PC games" arena.
The graphics turn people away. There are folks whom claim they don't care about graphics, but everybody, deep down inside, is a graphics whore. If this game looked like EVE and had those awesome "blinding-light-up-the-entire screen" explosion effects, nobody here would complain, and we'd be able to make some awesome trailers to put on YouTube and generate buzz. Flashy superficiality sells. Ask Las Vegas.
The only time graphics don't matter is when the title is some flash-based casual game like Farmville or Mafia Wars on Facebook. Those are intended as "sit down for 15 minutes" affairs. Allegiance is not one of those games. Allegiance is a game that appeals to the hardcore gamer, the gamer who is now playing some DirectX 11 almost-like-the-real-thing smash hit on their ATI 5850. Allegiance requires commitment, teamwork, and twitch-based gaming skills. With the crowd of gamers whom that appeals to comes a love for great graphics. Ignoring that is like ignoring that the sky is blue.
Dragon Age -- a game that also attracts the "hardcore" audience -- has been flamed relentlessly for its "bad graphics." For anybody who hasn't played it, go look at a screenshot. If THOSE are bad graphics, WTF is Allegiance?
Like I said, though, I have no solutions. I'm not even sure that there IS a viable solution. Overhauling the graphics engine would be a huge undertaking that even big-name developers with salaried employees very rarely do. Our best bet is to just keep shouting "FREE!" and "MADE BY MICROSOFT!" and hope people listen long enough for somebody to come out with a spiritual "Allegiance II."
The only time graphics don't matter is when the title is some flash-based casual game like Farmville or Mafia Wars on Facebook. Those are intended as "sit down for 15 minutes" affairs. Allegiance is not one of those games. Allegiance is a game that appeals to the hardcore gamer, the gamer who is now playing some DirectX 11 almost-like-the-real-thing smash hit on their ATI 5850. Allegiance requires commitment, teamwork, and twitch-based gaming skills. With the crowd of gamers whom that appeals to comes a love for great graphics. Ignoring that is like ignoring that the sky is blue.
Dragon Age -- a game that also attracts the "hardcore" audience -- has been flamed relentlessly for its "bad graphics." For anybody who hasn't played it, go look at a screenshot. If THOSE are bad graphics, WTF is Allegiance?
Like I said, though, I have no solutions. I'm not even sure that there IS a viable solution. Overhauling the graphics engine would be a huge undertaking that even big-name developers with salaried employees very rarely do. Our best bet is to just keep shouting "FREE!" and "MADE BY MICROSOFT!" and hope people listen long enough for somebody to come out with a spiritual "Allegiance II."
"Leave Bacon alone. When he's unsure of what sector he's in somehow it works out better." -Lee
Maybe people complain about Dragon Age's graphics, but that sure doesn't stop them from buying it and playing it to death, while it consistently snags 8/10s and 9/10s in reviews. Game success and gamer whining are completely independent of each other. The success of the Wii alone ought to put to rest the idea that graphics are king. Besides, referring to Dragon Age's audience as "hardcore" is inaccurate; it, like most big smash hit games, is fairly casual, and a more accurate description of its audience would be the "spend $50 on a brand-new game and play it for twenty hours" demographic, the quantity-focused type that's constantly moving from game to game, the kinds of people that haven't stuck around long enough to join a guild/clan/squad in any game but WoW.
Allegiance's target audience, on the other hand, are the whores. The people who pick up a game and devote themselves to it in a near-obsession lasting months or years. Rather than the people who picked up Dragon Age but will be playing a different game in two months, Allegiance is more suited for the nutjobs who're still playing Everquest II or Final Fantasy XI or Phantasy Star Online after so many years. It's more suited for the psychos who beat their way through Nethack's or Dwarf Fortress's unintuitive text-based interface, braved its immense learning curve, and managed to love the game despite it having graphics like this. And it's more suited for the people who love advanced games but also love not spending hundreds of dollars on games.
Allegiance's target audience, on the other hand, are the whores. The people who pick up a game and devote themselves to it in a near-obsession lasting months or years. Rather than the people who picked up Dragon Age but will be playing a different game in two months, Allegiance is more suited for the nutjobs who're still playing Everquest II or Final Fantasy XI or Phantasy Star Online after so many years. It's more suited for the psychos who beat their way through Nethack's or Dwarf Fortress's unintuitive text-based interface, braved its immense learning curve, and managed to love the game despite it having graphics like this. And it's more suited for the people who love advanced games but also love not spending hundreds of dollars on games.
I think I have something to say. It's been said before, by cookie, but it's worth repeating.
The no. 1 issue that needs to be improved it the newbee retention ratio.
that is, of the people who get to experience the game for a couple of hours, how many will decide to pick up the title and play with it for, say, a month.
As far as graphics go, this game is rated at "acceptable" in my eyes. Nothing's flashy, but everything works well and looks good enough for an enjoyable game. If the graphics and the UI (esp. the RTS part) get better, it's a good thing and will improve enjoyment - but high-end graphics are not the core of this game, in my oppinion (although, i would be very happy to see them new TF models come R6).
Allignace is a unique game, in that it is perhaps the first RTS/Shooter hybrid (is it?). It is no longer the only one (Crysis has a conquest mode). It certainly has strongpoints which are it's appeal.
Jimen, I have a disagreement with you. It's not that I don't agree with what you are saying, but rather that there is an attitude I feel in your words that is not consistant with getting new players. "If you're not willing to put yourself in a near obsession with this game, don't bother" is not going to get more players here. On the other hand, "This is a great game that you can come back to once a week or a month and it's still going to be insteresting after 10 months of play" is a selling point.
Bacon, It's not that I disagree with you regarding graphics, but you probably see a good thing or two in this game aside of it's cost otherwise you would not still be here. I reckon it's got real selling points, which should really be pushed. I reckon it's a gem of a game for all those people who enjoy co-op games, but would love a game with real competition that forces them to go against a real opposition as opposed to crappy drone AI.
For instance it might apeal to the AA3 community.
The no. 1 issue that needs to be improved it the newbee retention ratio.
that is, of the people who get to experience the game for a couple of hours, how many will decide to pick up the title and play with it for, say, a month.
As far as graphics go, this game is rated at "acceptable" in my eyes. Nothing's flashy, but everything works well and looks good enough for an enjoyable game. If the graphics and the UI (esp. the RTS part) get better, it's a good thing and will improve enjoyment - but high-end graphics are not the core of this game, in my oppinion (although, i would be very happy to see them new TF models come R6).
Allignace is a unique game, in that it is perhaps the first RTS/Shooter hybrid (is it?). It is no longer the only one (Crysis has a conquest mode). It certainly has strongpoints which are it's appeal.
Jimen, I have a disagreement with you. It's not that I don't agree with what you are saying, but rather that there is an attitude I feel in your words that is not consistant with getting new players. "If you're not willing to put yourself in a near obsession with this game, don't bother" is not going to get more players here. On the other hand, "This is a great game that you can come back to once a week or a month and it's still going to be insteresting after 10 months of play" is a selling point.
Bacon, It's not that I disagree with you regarding graphics, but you probably see a good thing or two in this game aside of it's cost otherwise you would not still be here. I reckon it's got real selling points, which should really be pushed. I reckon it's a gem of a game for all those people who enjoy co-op games, but would love a game with real competition that forces them to go against a real opposition as opposed to crappy drone AI.
For instance it might apeal to the AA3 community.